I like comics, How 'bout you?

Post by **Best First** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:02 pm

woo-ha!

World War Hulk preview here:

http://www.newsarama.com/WWLA_07/Marvel/mondo.html

Remember kids - fighting is cool.

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:59 pm

Fascism is a disease, and Hulk is the cure...

I think it's a fairly good thing with letting the Hulk bust up them Illuminati fascists. Naturally, as far as I can see, it would appear as if the story will eventually show that vengeance never really do anyone any good at all.

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:05 pm

KingMob wrote:Mighty Avengers was fun, but I won't be back for another ish. I picked it up mainly to see how Bendis reintroduced thought balloons, and wasn't disappointed. But like you say, I could care less for the characters, really.
The Widow isn't cool when she's an Avenger.
The New Avengers team (and artist) are just fundamentally more interesting.

I... don't get it? If you like the idea of the team, and most of it's characters, and you like the art, and thought the first issue was FUN, why... would you NOT pick it up??

Anyways, I'm a bit worried about the quality of the Annihilation sequel, Conquest.

The art teams sound and look pretty rubbish all around. Also, Giffen is NOT writing the main series!! >_< I spell doom and disappointment, even tho the covers released so far are the awesome.

What do you lot think? Also, I really really hope the villain isn't Kang the Conqueror, cause that would suck. I want the Beyonder.

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:36 pm

New Buffy comic. 's good. Yay.

Hound · Post by **Hound** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:43 pm

I picked up Mighty Avengers, my first Avengers comic.

Loved it. Can anyone recommend any other Avengers stuff?

KingMob · Post by **KingMob** » Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:14 pm

Predabot wrote:
KingMob wrote:Mighty Avengers was fun, but I won't be back for another ish. I picked it up mainly to see how Bendis reintroduced thought balloons, and wasn't disappointed. But like you say, I could care less for the characters, really.
The Widow isn't cool when she's an Avenger.
The New Avengers team (and artist) are just fundamentally more interesting.
I... don't get it? If you like the idea of the team and most of it's characters, and you like the art, and thought the first issue was FUN, why... would you NOT pick it up??

...yeah, the one of those I think I actually said was that I thought it was fun. Apols for any confusion, I shall try again, respecting your concerns:
The idea justifying the team getting their own book is 'eh', the only character I like in it is Black Widow (who isn't cool when she's an Avenger), and I wouldn't go so far as to say I actively like Cho's art.
I enjoyed the way the thought balloons were used.

Meanwhile, New Avengers has 4 of my all time favourite Marvel comic characters in it, an amazing artist I've followed for ages and the Mighty Avengers were in the latest issue (which was ace) anyway.

I'm going to pick up Nova anyway, and the presence of Star-Lord and Rocket Raccoon guarantee that mini a sale. The rest...will depend on how good the prologue is. I didn't get all the previous Annihilation minis and didn't regret it. Did you get them all? I really liked Annihilation, but yes, this could be a bad move. But dude, Rocket Raccoon!

Yay for Buffy! And the Confession was beautiful. It seems to be getting mixed reviews, but I luvved it. Did you guys like/dislike?

edit: haven't been really interested by the Hulk stuff, but those pages of him versus Black Bolt are awesome.

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:41 am

Yeah, I "got"

all of the old ones, and sure, not all of them had the same quality, Super Skrull had a very bad artist, but a good writer, Nova and Silver Surfer were both ace, and sadly the only one that had both subpar art and writing was the Ronan one.

( Oddly enough Ronan turned into one of me new favs in the main series tho.)

I'm afraid that I have to say that even tho Furmans track record on IDW has been good, his most recent forays into Marvel was... not so good.

I suppose your right about the prologue, we'll see wich of these storys that will interest me the most. Altho I don't particularly like Starlord, it's almost a given since Giffen is writing it.

Hey, why don't I shake up some info on the tie-ins and their creators?

Also, you really should check out Hulk right now, it's in the best state it's been in a decade or more.

Ozz · Post by **Ozz** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:22 am

Hound wrote:Loved it. Can anyone recommend any other Avengers stuff?

I really liked Kurt Busiek's Avengers. It's #1-56 of the third series. It may be slow and a bit dull at times, but I recommend to read all of his run, because it builds towards his last storyline which is basically an epic masterpiece.

Post by **Best First** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:47 am

Yes, i agree, although i think it peaks in the middle rather than at the end, with the conclusion to the Ultron saga, notably Thor being SuPerc00l!!! in particular.

After that i'd hop straight to Avengers Dissasembled and then pick up New Avengers, which has generally been great fun.

Not picked up Buffy yet - will bob in this week and get my S/O.

As an aside if i getthe new house i am after... there is a comic shop round the corner. Yes. (jinx) (d'oh).

On another note did anyone find the ending of Nextwave ever so slightly not as good as the rest of it? Issue 11 was blidning, issue 12 i felt less so.

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:12 am

Yeah, was a bit underwhelming. Giant dinosaur in a smoking jacket = teh gold. Plus explosions. Lacking much else, though.

Still good fun.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:52 pm

After issues 10 and 11, Ellis could have crapped into a polybag and I wouldn't have felt ripped off.

Post by **Best First** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:55 am

just a bit confused.

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 12:44 am

On the subject of the beaten-to-death Civil War ending, I just reread Kingdom Come and the ending of that is a little meh as well. I mean, Superman having a discussion with Captain Marvel while a nuke falls? And then Captain Marvel basically detonates it with lightning bolts? Whatthehuh? So I guess the lackluster ending is a proud tradition... cept Watchmen, of course.

Post by **Best First** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:51 am

Actually, i am coming around to the ending of Civil War - its basically (for me) an American symbol coming around to the idea that punching things is not always teh best way to solev a problem, even if it is you're natural instinct - its a bit of a slap in the face of the way of the gun (which i imagine in part is why so many people don't like it).

Plus the post CW status quo is pretty fun by and large.

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 3:18 pm

Yeah, CW definitely did its job in that sense.

The part that bugs me is the sudden change to Spidey after all the madness of The Other and Sins Past. There's just not been enough time to absorb all the changes. I mean, what happened to his arm-stingers? They showed up once in FNSM. Once!

I think there were some really good reasons for Peter to reveal his identity. It must be appealing to be on the side of the angels for a change for someone who is always so hounded. All his years of that would of course put him in the category of heroes who, whether they agreed with it or not, wanted the legitimacy. Not to mention the fact that his identity had to come out eventually. He knew that.

There wasn't enough in the stories. There hasn't been enough in all the Spidey books to recover from the massive curveballs they keep throwing.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:09 am

I agree. Some time to digest "Sins Past" would have been nice. The girl that Peter has been in love with, arguably moreso than even Mary Jane, has been revealed to have cheated on Peter with Norman Osborne. How about a year of stories where, whenever the chips are down, Peter doesn't think of Gwen? How about an imaginary "ideal universe" where Peter is actually married to Mary Jane, the woman who cares enough about him to not just give some guy a pity go-round while she's in a relationship? That would have been kind of cool. It would help to cement the idea that Mary Jane is not just "replacement Gwen." This could have been done in the background in "classic" done-in-one issues.

In "The Other" Spidey gets his eye ripped out, is beaten almost to death, discovers powers he never knew he had, dies, and is reborn with a bunch of new powers. That's some hefty stuff to deal with. Unfortunately, instead of being dealt with, he is tossed into civil war. Maybe he could have, I dunno, used some of those new powers to fight crime? Does Peter even do that anymore?

Let me think about that for a second. Uh...no. Apparently he doesn't. In Sins Past people were coming after him for supposedly killing their mother. In Skin Deep, he was attacked by a guy he'd been a jerk to in high school. In The Other, he was attacked by some guy who wanted to eat him. In Civil War, he was attacked by people who were pissed that he, I dunno, unregistered, or something.

Call me old fashioned, but I have been collecting Spider-Man comics for 15 years. In those 15 years, there was a pretty standard formula to Spider-Man's stories. His life would suck, he would go out and fight some supervillain, there would be some weird stuff going on in the background, and every couple of years, the plot threads would be brought together in some kind of event, the status quo would change a bit, and the character would deal with it as the cycle started again.

I LIKED that! It made sense. Peter's life was not "changed forever" at the climax of every storyline. Peter could, it seemed, leave the house and do something that would not throw his entire life into turmoil. Some days he would just fight Boomerang. No big deal. Boomarang is in town, he's starting some trouble, and Spidey stops him. When something DID happen, it was HUGE.

Do you remember when 6-issue storylines were events? "Holy crap!" you'd say, "This is going to take six-issues to tell? Wow!" Now EVERY story is a six-issue character changing arc. But the character changes, the arc ends, and a new arc starts, changes the character, etc.

The writers SAY they are doing this in the name of believability. "In the real world...yada yada yada." The Marvel Universe is NOT the real world. In the REAL WORLD, people wonder if there is an afterlife, if aliens exist, and if time-travel is theoretically possible. In the Marvel Universe, superheroes have been around since the 1930's. People are BORN with wings, eye beams, and the ability to control people's minds. Aliens are real and have attacked the Earth a couple of dozen times. And, every now and then, a tear in the fabric of space and time sends King Arthur into battle around Madison Square Garden. So injecting "reality" into that world is like putting a square peg into a round hole.

In OUR reality, the thought of masked people weilding god-like powers would be enough to want the government to take action. Of course, in OUR reality, the government would not have an army of giant death-dealing robots to threaten the population of god-like masked superbeings. In OUR reality, those same beings would not have spent 70 years fighting invaders from space or from the Earth's core.

Tossing "reality" into the Marvel Universe is akin to asking the reader to believe that the citzens of the Marvel Universe are completely unaffected by the 70 years of craziness that they have been subjected to. And THAT is the complete opposite of "reality." Look at OUR reality.

Was I the only one that read the 9/11 issue of Amazing Spider-Man and thought, "Aren't buildings demolished nearly every day in the Marvel Universe? Hell, don't entire cities ususally get messed up?"

Wow, that was a long rant. Let me just finish it up with this.

Read an Amazing Spider-Man trade, say Sins Past, and then read an issue of Amazing Spider-Man from 1987 and tell me which takes longer to read.

The Last Autobot · Post by **The Last Autobot** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 2:03 am

I prefer a somewhat intermediate point.

Neither Spidey is his own clone from 300 years of the future raised by his uncle along with a robot Gwen nor he is doing the same stupid thing or battling the same foes 24/7.

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 4:36 am

I like FNSM.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 5:10 am

sprunkner wrote:I like FNSM.

As do I. Old school!

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:20 pm

Even a Ben Reilly reference (lots of em actually). I find it funny how some of that Clone Saga stuff won't go away, no matter how much they want it to.

In other news, ASM 539... W. T. F? Is it the 90s again? Peter is working out all that anger he failed to work out during the "Beware the Desperate Clone's Rage and Sticky Webs That Stick To Things" saga, apparently, because he feels the need to tell us how he's going to cross the line. And kill some *************. And kill some other *************. That's right. He's a badass hero for the Pepsi generation. This ain't your father's Spider-Man.

Stracynski is going to make me drop the title right before he leaves.

Post by **Best First** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 10:44 am

ok, picked up a load of stuff yesteday:

ASM - actually quite liked it, until the last page - but found a lot of it quite moving - and **** me i love Garney's art.

USM - brilliant as always, Spidey giving DD lip and basically telling him he could take him all the way down to China Town if he had too way ace.
Thunderbolts - good stuff but i can't help but feel Ellis is a little on auto pilot here (which is still better than most people).

New Avengers - is the monkey's tricycle. Its that good. Agree great team and artist i have followed since he first popped up, and its probably his best ever work. The banter in thic comic is amazing.

The Confession - totally agree, thought it was superb. I know thereis some whining about the surrender thing but i think Marvel have basically made Cap cool as ****, and this issue sealed it. I am also sure i need a t-shirt that says Tony Stark is a dick. One other thing about this, can't help but feel Bendis showed his superiority to Millar in his handling of these 2 characters - not that Millar was bad, but Bendis nailed this and i think its pretty much (along with Cap 25) a must read for anyone who read CW.

and

Buffy - brilliant. I almost cried. in a good way. from my special eye. And the Nick Fury references were amazing.

Oh, and i think the brilliance of the last 2 TF comics should get a nod here as well.

AND I AM MOVING TO A HOUSE WITH A COMIC SHOP ROUND THE CORNER.

Kwality.

Yaya · Post by **Yaya** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:05 pm

Picking up:

Iron Fist: Love the art, and the story ain't bad either

Civil War: Initiative: Didn't buy a single issue of Civil War, didn't need to as it's been summarized for me ad nauseum. I actually find the fallout more interesting anyway.

The New Avengers, just giving it a trial

Omega Flight, same reason, just to try it out

Silent War, just cause I like Black Bolt

Wolverine, just for the Sabretooth stuff. Once that's done, I'm out

Annihilation Heralds, just cause I like the cosmic stuff

Nova, cause I really like his character. He was some cheapo in the past, now I like his personality, sort of a cosmic Spiderman-type.

On the subject of the beaten-to-death Civil War ending, I just reread Kingdom Come and the ending of that is a little meh as well. I mean, Superman having a discussion with Captain Marvel while a nuke falls? And then Captain Marvel basically detonates it with lightning bolts? Whatthehuh? So I guess the lackluster ending is a proud tradition... cept Watchmen, of course.

I even thought Watchmen ended lame, at least by todays standards. Do agree with the Kingdom Come ending as well. Enjoyed Marvels more, actually.

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:40 pm

Yeah, Yaya. I was very pleasantly surprised with the Heralds, the one-shot stories very much retain the look and feel of the new Post-Annihilation style Marvel Cosmic.

Especially the Stardust story was uber-cool. I suppose Terrax maybe had the best single moment tho! ^^ SLIIIICE!!

As you lot know, I went by New York recently, and MIDTOWN COMICS!

Awesome store that, I wish I had one in my own mini-town...

I gots me: Phoenix Endsong, Kravens Last Hunt (Brilliant! Possibly the best Spidey-story ever), Marvels ( already read, but needed a copy of my own), Chronological Superman v.2 ( Earth-2 Superman, BABY!), and my first Masterworks. Fantastic Four v.8, allround Kirby-powah'.

Ozz · Post by **Ozz** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:17 pm

Best First wrote:USM - brilliant as always, Spidey giving DD lip and basically telling him he could take him all the way down to China Town if he had too way ace.

USM is superb again after a bit of a dive the book took around Deadpool. Kitty in Peter and MJ's school should also be aces. Shame it doesn't really fit with Ultimate X-Men. This issue also seems to reveal who'll be the Ronin in the next issue, but Bendis already showed he can fool the reader, so I smell a cheat here, too.

About New Avengers, how good is this book post CW when compared with first 20 issues? Because that probably was the most disappointing stuff I read in a while. I haven't read the issues with Yu on art yet, and I don't really know if I should.

Post by **Best First** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:14 pm

uh. well teh last arc and some of the Civil war shots aside, i liked NA from the get go, so i may not be the right person to ask.

The Sabretooth stuff in Wolvie is bollocks IMO...

Hound · Post by **Hound** » Fri Mar 30, 2007 10:31 pm

I have just started reading New Avengers from the beginning and I love it.

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Sat Mar 31, 2007 4:04 am

I'm getting (besides everything TF):

New Avengers: Good book though Bendis' pacing is a bit too slow. And I miss David Finch's art. And CW played merry hell with the storylines thus turning the team into Heroes For Hire. (I miss having a team with Captain America and Thor. Ditto on the early Busiek.) And Yu is not as good as Finch, though I'm warming. And and whine whine.

Thunderbolts: I don't follow Ellis, and if this is him on autopilot, I say I've been missing out. The vignettes of the different villians in prison in the last issue (112) were great. I'll have to pick up StormWaveTransAuthority and all of those million other books. Did anyone read his late 90s run on Thor? Supposedly good, in a very anti-Thor-purist way.

FNSM: Love it. Said that already. A Spidey title with a supporting cast that doesn't sh*t on continuity—in fact, it mines some really obscure stuff with great results.

ASM: Blechhh. Garney's better than Deodato, but he's no JRjr. What were once the most original Spidey stories in years have been merrily ravaged by CW and the Other. The book needs to go back to real stories and away from "events."

Speaking of the Other, has anyone noticed it's getting retconned? Spidey used the talons once—in FNSM—since the crossover. No references to his improved sight or even organic webshooters.

I read the trades (sometimes even buy them!) for Y, Ex Machina, USM, Ultimates (been waiting on that one), Daredevil and Sensational Spidey (that Feral bit was sheer crap). Barnes & Noble is a wonderful place. And I severely covet the New X-Men omnibus.

Post by **Best First** » Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:59 am

Spidey uses his organic webs in the most recent ASM on the cop on the stairs.

Can't say i miss the stingers.

maybe they just retconned the other cos they realised that having Pat Lee as part of Spidey history was a bit wee.

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Sat Mar 31, 2007 2:57 pm

Yeah, maybe.

I figured the Other would eventually get retconned, but I thought they would at least try to do something with the story possibilities.

KingMob · Post by **KingMob** » Sun Apr 01, 2007 10:44 am

The organic webs are staying, according to previews for One More Day. Haven't they tried to say that the stingers only 'deploy' when Spidey fights magic types or somesuch? TBH, I'm not caring that much as I only get USM and MJ luvs Spidey now, dropped ASM a long time ago and just went back for Civil War.

The Confession really was gorgeous and a great coda to CW, I'm surprised more people aren't really praising it. I guess the loudness really does only comes out when people want to bitch. Bendis owns all with his dialogue scenes, the guy has his 'vocal' tics and I'm sure his pacing annoys people, but pair him up with an artist that can capture facial expression and/or mood and it's gold. I mean, Confession is basically a monologue and it's totally absorbing.

New Avengers is generally being considered by the net majority as better post-CW than pre, but've also quite liked all of it really, so...
Where did you read up to beforehand? Some (not all) of the NA CW issues were CW highlights IMHO - the Cage issue (with Yu on art) and the Iron Man issue. The current story is fast paced and has a lot in it, and I think it's only 2 issues in?

Hooray for someone else picking up Iron Fist!

Silent War has great Frazer Irving art and the latest issue is heavily worth checking out by anyone who reads X-Factor.