Regeneration One 80.5

[inflatable dalek]

SPOILERIFIC THOUGHTS


[Not that there's a huge amount to spoile, 98% recycled material]


To be completely fair, I'm going to judge this on its own merits without any comparisons to G2, Another Time and Place, the UK G2 Annual, the fan club tat or any and all other previous post-Marvel stuff.

Well, the introduction from Furman where he lists his and Wildman's post-Transformers credits in a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things is hilarious and almost worth five stars by itself.

Other than that, mostly what the preview made it look. Lots of badly drawn pointless flashbacks (dear God, Fortress Maximus has a head that's the Transformers equivalent of the Elephant Man).

For the non-flashback stuff, I'm really not sure having Optimus bored and disinterested in the whole thing was a good idea. And considering I think they spoke about twice in the original series him picking Hot Rod as his special student (?! what do they do all day alone on top of a hill?) seems very odd. As does the mention of the Covenant of Primus.

Soundwave got the good bits, using Megatron's name and legacy to rally the "Neo Decepticons" felt very true to his UK best, and the no nonsense Goldeneye plan was nice and straightforward. It was also cool that his troops were mostly made of ones from towards the end of the Marvel days.

But, the ponderous (and unexplained) Furman spoofing narration dragged it down, Magnus is the IDW version, and I'm actually not entirely sure if that was the actual Last Autobot (in which case he's been on the Atkins diet since 80) or a badly made statue that got blown up at the end. If it is the later, why was he just standing in the middle of the street like that for no reason? It doesn't help those hypothetical new readers work out why his death might be a bad thing.

One odd thing, with the inclusion of stuff from the UK comic (the Baird transmitter is a bit of an odd callback isn't it?) it's surprising there's nothing including from it in the flashbacks. You'd have thought at least some of those events would have stuck in Mystery Voice Over's memory.

I wonder when Prime found out about what happened on the Ark?

The colouring is a bit odd, Prowl is in his Marvel scheme, Soundwave is purple in the flashback but blue in the present and Megatron has the black helmet throughout.

Oh, and the whole thing shamelessly recycled from Furman's Energon comic.

The real damning thing is, this dropped through the letter box at the same time as MTMTE 5. A comic that builds on Furman's groundwork (albeit without being set in the same Universe) in a much more solid, intelligent and enjoyable way. And Last Stand did the taking the piss out of Furmanisms thing better as well.

[Alarums & Excursions]

The grumpy old git of TF forums strikes again. I've seen your posts over at TFArchive, which has to be the most miserable, moaning fansite ever, and the venom verges on the personal. Do you get any enjoyment out of Transformers at all? If not, maybe it's time to find another interest.

[inflatable dalek]

Lets do this bullet point style:

A: Yes, I do get enjoyment out of Transformers. The majority of my reviews at the Archive are positive, it was only after the comic hit a real long period of crap that I stopped both doing them and buying the comic.

B: TFA isn't some huge gestalt with everyone thinking the same. I didn't pay much attention to comments on the Costa run but there were posters who liked AHM very much (including this sites own Yaya. Though he seemed to change his mind the second issue 13 hit and declared the previous 12 suddenly crap. But that sort of wackiness is why we love him).

C: More Than Meets the Eye is great, and RID has been a fairly solid if flawed book. The worst issue for me this year, RID 4, mainly suffered from being a bit dull and is considerably better than the McCarthy crap that drove me off reading. I'm expecting IDW editorial (who I consider to be the source of most of the problems the company have had, "Hey, this guy who admits he doesn't get the characters, lets give him the Ongoing job!") to drop the ball sooner rather than later, I'm enjoying the ride whilst it lasts. The Dreamwave style "Months" we've got coming up look like a worrying wobble and IDW have never seemed able to cope with the fact they're only going to sell aprox 12K copies an issue no matter what leading to all sorts of stupid relaunches/abandoning of plans but I have faith in Roberts and think Barber is OK considering he's got the much harder book to write.

D: Did you miss the bit in the above post where I said nice things about MTMTE 4?

E: Have you actually read the issue? You don't make any comment on it but I'm really going to have to hope so (I didn't realise when I posted this thread it wasn't free comic book day till the 5th, my supplier must have just bunged it in with MTMTE 4 to save on postage, I guess you would have gotten yours the same way?) because you'd look pretty silly if you wind up reading it and going "Wow, this actually is crap". I mean, I offer reasons for my not enjoying the issue, you haven't been able to come up with anything to counter them or anything you enjoyed about it.

F: And you do realise the inherent irony in whining about whining? Indeed, as this is your one and only post at the time of writing that means 100% of your contribution to this site is moaning and borderline personal attacks about things no one is making you read.

And no, I won't be reading Regeneration 1. I gave the free issue a try and feel it wasn't worth what I paid for it. I'll stick with the Marvel continuation actually published by Marvel and feel no need to throw cash at two past their best creators going through their mid-life crisis (I really wish Wildman had stuck to his "I've had enough of Transformers and am resigning from it and this has nothing to do with the fact I'm not getting any work from it at the moment" announcement at AA a few years ago and Furman seems determined to prove he's Chris Clarermont).

I'm sure people both here and at TFA will enjoy it, and more power to them. Back and forth debate over the merits of an issue are always part of the fun of discussion boards (which is why it's great we don't all agree), but this is poor enough I've no desire to even pirate it to join in the debate.

[Alarums & Excursions]

If you were just critiquing, I wouldn't be quite so inspired to post. I'm just not interested in the anonymous internet culture of bile. But this?

<<Well, the introduction from Furman where he lists his and Wildman's post-Transformers credits in a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things is hilarious and almost worth five stars by itself. >>

What's that if not throwing petulant mud at respected creators? You know what they say, 'those who can, teach. Those who can't, criticize.'

[Denyer]

Ye gods, have really got to get caught up on forums and email this weekend.

I wonder how many other people got it a few days early?

Can't expect too much from a FCBD story that either has to be recapped in the first issue or completely throwaway, but it was pleasant enough. Nothing very remarkable. The war's been on hiatus and then Soundwave decides to blow up the Last Autobot, who's (symbolically or literally) been overseeing Cybertron. You'd think that the planet would have orbital defences or that the deus ex machina character would be a bit less easy to conveniently edit out.

Compared to US G2, with the Great War revealed as a playground squabble when compared to the galactic scale of the Liege Maximo's forces... just not excited, really. It's true to the late-(pre-G2)-era Marvel voice, and that's partly the problem. We're currently seeing what can be done by a writer (Roberts) who's internalised all of that and grafted on densely-written snark, commentary and characterisation. Anything else is likely to suffer by comparison.

[inflatable dalek]

If you were just critiquing, I wouldn't be quite so inspired to post. I'm just not interested in the anonymous internet culture of bile.

Who's anonymous? I may post under a nickname, but my real identity is no secret. I've even (in one of the more surreal moments of my life) once had someone stop me at a comic event to compliment me on my TFA reviews. The most ready way to find out more than you will even need to know about me is to click on my needs-to-be-updated blog link below Though does the fact I'm Stuart Webb, live in Kidderminster and work for Tesco mean anything more to you than "Inflatable Dalek"? I doubt it very much, because I'm rightly completely unimportant and insignificant.

Now you on the other hand, seem to be at least an anonymous as I am, and have posted nothing but bile to date. You're doing what you're complaining about far more than I am, the word for that is hypocrite. I do hope you've actually signed up to do more than take pot shots at me, because the word for that is trolling.

You did side step me asking if you've also read the thing ahead of everyone else. So again, if you've read the issue and think my opinion is unfair, where do you disagree? If you'd come in and gone "Well you're clearly on the Jazz man because this was brilliant because..." or pointed out any mistakes (and looking back, there is at least one brain fart in there where I wonder when Prime found out about events on the Ark, the flashbacks are all narrated by the as yet unidentified Garth Marenghi style narrator*) there'd be no problem here. All you've basically come in and done is go "You suck, because people who say things suck suck".

But this?

<<Well, the introduction from Furman where he lists his and Wildman's post-Transformers credits in a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things is hilarious and almost worth five stars by itself. >>

What's that if not throwing petulant mud at respected creators? You know what they say, 'those who can, teach. Those who can't, criticize.'

I think it's entirely fair to say that the two's non TF comic career is mediocre at best (though both have been successful in other areas). They're only really respected by TF fandom, and considering how myoptic they can be (Costa was actually right on how TF fans aren't generally comic readers, but he failed to follow through on the logic that he fans are as equally ill informed as his detractors) I doubt even they have any interest in his non Death's Head (and by extension Dragon's Claws to a less extent) extra curricular activity. Even at the height of their pomp Dreamwave couldn't get anyone interested in Necrowar.

So, whilst it's impressive he managed to get a 90's Marvel Mutant book cancelled, running off a list of books that were generally very short lived, frequently cancelled due to low sales (even occasionally as part of the collapse of the publisher), or regarded as terrible (the early 7th Doctor comic strips are pretty much the only era of DWM's strips that are treated with complete apathy by fans) as if it's supposed to look good is very, very funny.

And frankly, Furman's been treated by IDW with far less respect than by any fan. Booted off the main book with little ceremony once it was felt sales weren't good enough (they've only rarely gone up since though) and called a liar by his editors over the whole "This Mosaic is canon" thingbefore being shoved in a cupboard and fed the odd breadcrumb like Movie comics he's not suited for and now a Marvel continuation Hasbro didn't want and IDW themselves seem apathetic on.

If there is a chance he'd have gotten regular writing gigs from anyone else he'd have walked off with dignity intact after the Hail and Farewell piss take (which is a classic example of IDW editorial ballsing things up, would it really have been so hard to just go "This was planned to be part of our main canon but changing plans means this has shifted about a bit" rather than "Furman said that? He nuts!").

And the saying is "Those who can do, those who can't coach". Nothing to do with critics, I've got a feeling it's got its origin in baseball (though as I think this was something I once heard in a pub that's probably dubious). And IDW themselves seemed to think Furman could no longer "Do" when they moved him off the front bench and into the subs four years ago.

Though Furman's real legacy, the one that will sustain long after IDW have gone the way of Pat Lee, the reason I have been proud to meet him at several AA's, is the Marvel UK comic. Not for what he did with Transformers as such, but because (much like Terrance Dicks was in the 70's with the Who books) he was responsible for the literacy of an entire generation of British boys. I learnt to read from that comic (I cop to the poor spelling being my own though), as it seems did James Roberts and no doubt many, many others. That's an amazingly positive impact to have had and one he should be amazingly proud of.

But like Claremont (and has anyone ever had anything nice to say about his "What if I never left X-Men" book?) for all he's done in the past what the franchise needs is to move on. Furman's arguably been lucky for the last decade that virtually every new writer hired for the franchise is much, much worse. It's nice to see that starting to change. I've never understood why both DW and IDW were happy to tap the fan community for artists but never writers.

Picking the best fan fic writers and giving them a shot on The New Adventures has paid great dividends for all forms of Doctor Who so it's good to see that beginning to come in slowly at IDW after it was starting to look as if Nick Roche was a one off fluke.

Once 80.5 does get out there on Saturday I've no doubt mine will quickly become the minority opinion on here as there is a huge amount of excitment out there for this that I must admit to finding baffling. I do think IDW has mis-marketed it (calling it issue 1 in a new series set in the Marvel Universe would be fairer, it's by no means a real 81 and pushing it as a direct pick up is only going to annoy anyone who hasn't been following the PR interviews), but I'd be amazed if this doesn't go down very well.


*This is not as awesome as it sounds.

[Alarums & Excursions]

My name's Steve Gigg. I live in Wallington, Surrey. I service cars. Nice to meet you.

And no, I haven't read #80.5 yet. Like most of us, I'm looking forward to Saturday and it's general release. But whatever I think of the issue, I doubt I'll get up on my soapbox and denigrate anyone's career, which is what you did (and have done a lot of over at TFArchive). I'm not sure what you judge success on, but frankly anyone's comic career that is still ticking along after 25 or so years (after the boom and bust of the 90s, which accounted for many of those cancellations you cite as some kind of proof of mediocrity) deserves nothing but praise. If you can't see that 'a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things' is anything other than flaming or trolling or whatever you call it, then you've got a problem. It's offensive, untrue and unfair. I mean, what did posting that achieve?

And as for your 'critique' of #80.5, you do realize that this FREE issue is designed, according to all the IDW pre-release press, to be a catch up/jumping on point for readers as much as anything. So by necessity it's going to be light on story. I mean, how much do you want for you £0.00? Even if I am disappointed with 80.5, I'll certainly be picking up 81. But maybe I'm just more willing to give 'the series' a chance. I can't help but feel you had this pegged as a failure long before you ever got a copy in your hands.

[bumblemusprime]

Dude.

People give things bad reviews.

It's not a slight against the artist. It's not a slight against the writer. I got a bad review of one of my published short stories because the person totally missed an important detail in the story and spent her time going "Why are they doing this?" She would have figured it out if she read the ****ing third paragraph.

I don't care. That's part of publication. I am allowed to think she's an idiot, but it would be dumb for me to get upset because someone gave my work a bad review. And this was a professional reviewer.

I don't understand this urge to defend the poor artists and writers who get paid for their work and in Furman's case, have a legion of fans who will buy it no matter what. This is how the world works. You write. People review. Some people don't like it. The artist/writer still gets paid for it.

Jeez.

[DJ_Convoy]

I liked it fine. Yeah, it was mostly flashback. The bits with Prime were very interesting. Why has Prime disconnected so much? To me, this is intriguing, as is Prime's sudden interest in Hot Rod as an acolyte. The bits with Soundwave were fantastic. Wildman's art is as wonky as ever. But good wonky- it's nice to see it again, as opposed to Dreamwave-lite. Familiar. Was this the best issue ever? Nah. It's a game of catch-up. But the teases for things to come were more than sufficently interesting. I enjoyed the overwrought narration. Perhaps there's a overwrought narrator, yes? We don't know yet.

I think ID is being a little harsh on the issue, but that's his perogative; it doesn't have to be everyone's cuppa. Just as it's mine to point out that this is a primer, not a first issue. It's also my perogative to say that his opinion that the credit rolecall was "a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things is hilarious" is a pretty ****** thing to say. Furman and Wildman did do lotsa stuff after Transformers in 1991. That's not resume-padding; it's the truth.

[Alarums & Excursions]

But it's not merely a matter of 'poor artists and writers', what ticks me off is this kind of blanket impunity to slag off people, full stop. Fine, criticize the work, but be constructive at least somewhere in there, and avoid the purely personal, and in this case wrong. Why shouldn't I say something's not on. It's not trolling, it's just pointing something out.

The biggest problem with the Internet is there's no accountability. Anything goes. I just happen to think people who post need to have some kind of lines that they don't cross. And slagging off anyone for a cheap laugh isn't big or clever. Would you walk up to Wildman at a signing and say his art sucks? I doubt it.

Jeez.

[Denyer]

anyone's comic career that is still ticking along after 25 or so years (after the boom and bust of the 90s, which accounted for many of those cancellations you cite as some kind of proof of mediocrity) deserves nothing but praise

By that logic, folk such as Rob Liefield and Pat Lee should be accorded respect for an ability to negotiate contracts (or maybe they know where bodies are buried) rather than draw, write or whatever their name's on books for.

in this case wrong.

What major comics or TV work has Furman had that isn't odds and sods? In quite a small field, the thing with a shot of seeing him in a Top 100 is Transformers.

It's not that he can't bring an A-game. Personally, my appreciation for the original Marvel series, UK and US, is influenced by nostalgia, but US G2 (IMO) stands up a little more objectively as a good comic against various others -- including the details of production such as layouts. It's a complete package, and whilst we can't be sure how it would have panned out as a longer series, what we got was great fun. It's very difficult now to come up with things that haven't been done with the property (apart from much character writing on par with, say, Joss Whedon, Gail Simone, Neil Gaiman, Ed Brubaker, Warren Ellis, Alan Moore, Kurt Busiek, to pick a few.)

There's nothing wrong with being a license or genre writer (eg, Ed Greenwood) and they do have a habit of getting screwed around by rewrites beyond their control, but when individuals of Shane McCarthy's calibre can get onto Batman -- with that Riddler story* -- it's not going to produce "we're not worthy" responses. And the buck ultimately stops with IDW (or other) editors, but Furman also has some responsibility for the handling of the series he's written.

*He's done better elsewhere.

Would you walk up to Wildman at a signing and say his art sucks?

Different contexts; I generally don't say things at a distance I won't say to people's faces, with the possible exception of violent idiots with control issues, but this doesn't equate to finding them, holding them down and forcing them to listen. Given the question "Do you think this was any good?" then "Sorry, thought it was crap and here's why..." is a fair response, and the question's asked by producing something that someone has forked over money to obtain.

this FREE issue [...] how much do you want for you £0.00?

A lot of people will pay, as do the stores taking part, because as much as it'd be nice to have a friendly, reasonably priced local shop and/or time to go there, in practice it isn't like that for a lot of the remaining comics audience. Most stores can't match online retailers for collected volumes and have become game/collectibles outlets, so the days of print singles are probably still numbered as the number of outlets decreases.

Worth it as a larger taster than the images released online, IMO. IDW have by this point had a very mixed output over the time they've had the license and it's better than buying the first issue of a miniseries and finding it's AHM or Bumblebee style/quality.

[inflatable dalek]

My name's Steve Gigg. I live in Wallington, Surrey. I service cars. Nice to meet you.

Hello! See, who we really are in completely meaningless. Unless like Brendocon you're secretly everyone.

But whatever I think of the issue, I doubt I'll get up on my soapbox and denigrate anyone's career, which is what you did (and have done a lot of over at TFArchive).

I'm certainly not on a soapbox, only one person in this thread seems to be ranting and raving and to have apointed themselves guardian of the morals of the internet.

I'm not sure what you judge success on, but frankly anyone's comic career that is still ticking along after 25 or so years (after the boom and bust of the 90s, which accounted for many of those cancellations you cite as some kind of proof of mediocrity) deserves nothing but praise. If you can't see that 'a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things' is anything other than flaming or trolling or whatever you call it, then you've got a problem. It's offensive, untrue and unfair. I mean, what did posting that achieve?

Yes, he's had a long career. A long career of mediocrity. People who get the work done on time will always have a place, especially on uncared for second string titles. And most of that career length is entirely down to various publishers not knowing what else to do with Transformers. Before War Within it had been, what, seven (?) years since his last regular comics gig? If Dreamwave hadn't come along he'd still be a books editor.

Since then, the amount of work he's got that hasn't just been a case of "Well, it's Transformers and for some reason people don't seem to like our Eric Holmes initiative, guess it'd better be Furman then" is pretty much tiny. And even tinier if you remove the two attempts to bring Death's Head back (one of which was abysmal and the other of which made him look cursed as Panini's remaining "Marvel UK" stuff was almost instantly taken off them after it came out).

And as for your 'critique' of #80.5, you do realize that this FREE issue is designed, according to all the IDW pre-release press, to be a catch up/jumping on point for readers as much as anything. So by necessity it's going to be light on story. I mean, how much do you want for you £0.00?

I didn't complain about the amount of story (other than joking there wasn't going to be much in the way of spoilers), just that two thirds of it wasn't very good. The Soundwave/Goldeneye riffing stuff is fine, but for me the Prime stuff was very tired and unengaging and the flashback material is done really badly with a voiceover that genuinely reads like a fan piss take of Furman's more ponderous "Serious and epic" narrations.

And the problem with the idea behind the series being out there on the internet is that it assumes no one who hasn't been following the fourms will be picking the book up. Considering the steady but fairly small average sales that may be a fair assumption, but considering how accessible this book is supposed to be it's a surprise they'd expect people to have done their homework first. Anyone who hasn't seen Furman interviews and picks up this or the first issue would very likely expect something very different from something continuing the numbering system directly.

Though that's not the first time IDW seem to have assumed only people on their forums are buying the books. The big problem with the ...Tion/AHM divide wasn' so much the discontinuity (though the promise that everything would tie together when it ultimately didn't was an issue), but that the reader would have to be following all the behind the scenes grubbins to follow how (or even if) Revelation, Maximum Dinobots and AHM were supposed to click together.

Even if I am disappointed with 80.5, I'll certainly be picking up 81. But maybe I'm just more willing to give 'the series' a chance. I can't help but feel you had this pegged as a failure long before you ever got a copy in your hands.

I was certainly happy to give it a go as a free book despite everything that had come out before being deeply unpromising because I have been very wrong in my expectations before ("A Ramjet Spotlight from the talentless hack who did that blood terrible New Avengers crossover, that'll suck harder that a two dollar whore. It'll be so bad that... ohhhh do it again! Do it again!").

Though with this under my belt, all the promotional material spelling out what sort of book it's going to be (the low point being Furman feeling the need to slag off G2 for being "Too 90's", considering that's regarded as some of his best work that's just begging for negative comparisons. What would have been wrong with just going "We're going in our own different direction to G2 so it can be a proper 81"?) and the two talents recent form, I think I've got enough to have a fair opinion of what the book is going to be like.

Though if Furman does get to the end of the 20 issue run without resorting to that extremely tired standby of his, the mysterious and overly pompous men in black organisation using Transformer technology for EVIL ends, I'll give him a lolly.

And the last book I gave a full fair chance to was All Hail Megatron. Eeeks. Though rereading it recently moved on from the perspective of giving a toss about the IDWverse it's actually bloody hilarious. Completely unintentionally, but still very very funny. And in fairness, Guido's art is much, much better than I gave it credit at the time, I think a couple of years of artists struggling with the movieverse inspired designs (and what was the the thinking about that? "Hey, you know a lot of the fanboys aren't keen on the films? And how artists really hate drawing the Movieverse characters because what works on screen in expensive CGI whirling over your head doesn't translate well to the page? Lets piss both off by making all the G1 characters really ****** up looking!") has shown up exactly how nice and crisp the original character models are.

Wildman's art is as wonky as ever. But good wonky- it's nice to see it again, as opposed to Dreamwave-lite. Familiar.

I think the problem for me is Wildman's art just doesn't suit modern colouring, it tends to wash out the scratchy details, and even work against the art in places (he's drawing everything as slightly beaten up and worn, it's coloured as bright and shiny and new).

I think ID is being a little harsh on the issue, but that's his perogative; it doesn't have to be everyone's cuppa. Just as it's mine to point out that this is a primer, not a first issue. It's also my perogative to say that his opinion that the credit rolecall was "a desperate attempt to make it look like they've done other things is hilarious" is a pretty ****** thing to say. Furman and Wildman did do lotsa stuff after Transformers in 1991. That's not resume-padding; it's the truth.

It's basically a list of comics generally regarded as being crap though. Not a huge selling point. How many people, even amongst their fans, have actually read most of that stuff? I can manage DH and Claws (both good fun if flawed. Death's Head is a brilliant character but frequently in poor plots with weak villains, whilst the Claws have a great setting and ideas but dull characters. It almost would have worked better if he'd made Death's Head part of a team somehow), a bit of Alpha Flight, Necrowar (for my sins), the truly terrible Death's Head 3 and the, to be fair, hugely fun recent return of the original DH. On Wildman's solo non TF stuff I've recently read his run on GI Joe which was OKish but you can tell he really didn't enjoy it (he felt Joe was too violent oddly enough). That's only a small selection, but still not a great hit rate.

Oddly, though I'm not sure how true it is now, back when I first joined fandom everyone seemed to have read a couple of issues of Alpha Flight. I wonder if it was the same couple being endlessly passed around second hand comic shops?

The biggest problem with the Internet is there's no accountability. Anything goes. I just happen to think people who post need to have some kind of lines that they don't cross. And slagging off anyone for a cheap laugh isn't big or clever. Would you walk up to Wildman at a signing and say his art sucks? I doubt it.

No, but then I'm not doing that here. Unless he's secretly posting. And if he does stumble across this (or worse yet, actually googles himself) this thread will almost certainly soon be swamped with people who like the work and he won't care what I think in the least.

And there is accountability on the internet, if people post stupid or uninteresting things constantly they just wound up being ignored. You don't need to set yourself up as the arbiter of fair online behaviour. Especially as you have been acting in the same way you're complaining about. Effectively the bulk of your posts to date have been the equivalent of coming up to my face and saying what I've written is stupid. I can more than live with it, but I'm amazed you can't see the double standard there. Nor why you're so defensive of Furman and Wildman in particular when I've been equally, if not more, scathing of McCarthy, Costa and, well, just about everyone else IDW have employed over the last few years as well in this thread.

[Best First]

I though there was a slight glee to the fisrt post at how dissapointing it was percieved to be.

But my subsequent thought was "whatevs"

Looking forward to this, but having it come out at the same time as MTMTE is pretty much the worst thing for all involved.

[inflatable dalek]

Only gleeful in the sense I won't be adding a third IDW comic to my buying habits after so firmly swearing off them three (? Whenever the ongoing started) years ago. God damn James Roberts getting me back on the crack cocaine that is modern TF comics.

Looking forward to this, but having it come out at the same time as MTMTE is pretty much the worst thing for all involved.

Considering Furman seems to have been given some quite heavy constraints on what he can and can't do with this book (which isn't automatically a bad thing, I think he's always worked best under the gun even if that's not so evident here) I'm surprised he's being allowed to explore some of the same "Post war Cybertron at the point things are starting to fall apart again" ideas as RID, with three books on the go at once I'd have thought they'd have been keen to have them as different as possible right from the off.

[bumblemusprime]

I'm looking forward to it. We have:

MTMTE: An ideal comic all around.

On a tier slightly below it, we have:

RID: Great ambition, great concepts, but the story lurches drunkenly along, in odd directions, and needs more humor a la MTMTE
Regeneration One: The usual collection of Furman's glories and flaws, which we know so well.

Why is this bad? We used to have on terrible ongoing! I'll gladly dish out 12$ a month for these babies. I'll give up three lattes for three quality TF comics, even if the quality varies a bit for two of them.

[Sunyavadin]

Bumblemus speaks the truth.

Can we do less?

Sure, for some of us this may be surplus to requirements. Some of us want to accept that the G1 story is over...finished! But, looming over us like some vast, predatory bird, we have to accept that it never ends. We wanted this, and now we reap the whirlwind. And if it leaves some fans with the worst case of indigestion they've ever had, then maybe a short, sharp lesson was what they needed. Otherwise, what chance do we have?




....Time I wasn't here...

[Denyer]

Has anyone done a Furmanisms bingo card?

[spiderfrommars]

Bumblemus speaks the truth.

Can we do less?

Sure, for some of us this may be surplus to requirements. Some of us want to accept that the G1 story is over...finished! But, looming over us like some vast, predatory bird, we have to accept that it never ends. We wanted this, and now we reap the whirlwind. And if it leaves some fans with the worst case of indigestion they've ever had, then maybe a short, sharp lesson was what they needed. Otherwise, what chance do we have?

I will read this... or die in the attempt!

[Kaylee]

Bumblemus speaks the truth.

Can we do less?

Sure, for some of us this may be surplus to requirements. Some of us want to accept that the G1 story is over...finished! But, looming over us like some vast, predatory bird, we have to accept that it never ends. We wanted this, and now we reap the whirlwind. And if it leaves some fans with the worst case of indigestion they've ever had, then maybe a short, sharp lesson was what they needed. Otherwise, what chance do we have?

I will read this... or die in the attempt!

This cannot- MUST not- continue!

[Alarums & Excursions]

Here’s my review of #80.5 (spoilers abound, be warned):

It may only be 16 pages but it accomplishes a lot. Okay, it’s not going to trouble anyone’s top ten comics of all time, but it had a really tight, cohesive structure (that tidily makes the recaps inclusive of the whole) and nice mirrored dialogue beginning and end.

Dismantling the issue somewhat, the 4 double-page recap spreads are pretty enough - the equivalent of a series of posters. Wildman’s art may be a little wobbly at times, even structurally incorrect — there are certainly a few scale issues — but so it was back in the day. I’d have actually been disappointed if it conformed to the new machine-tooled art age ushered in by Dreamwave and continued by IDW. As it stands, it feels as if no time at all has passed since issue #80 (or rather #332) dropped through my letterbox. Warm, fuzzy nostalgia feelings. Better colouring, that’s all!

I didn’t hate the overblown narration-style caption either. Again, it smacked of those old issues (particularly Marvel UK) I loved. And viewed together they do a good enough job of condensing 80 odd issues, which is no mean feat. They kind of fall short of being enough for a completely new reader, but are better than nothing. Nice seeing Wildman reinterpret some of the older scenes he never drew and the newer ones he did.

So, the rest - The re-introduction to Cybertron sets the scene quickly and efficiently, as do the Soundwave rallying the troops sequence and the Prime/Nova Point sequence. Soundwave is presented at his UK best, disseminating Megatron’s raison d'être in coldly economical fashion. He doesn’t seem to be trying to usurp Megatron, but rather keep the torch burning in his absence. Plays well with his established character: Loyal, but capable in his own right. And Prime? Well, what’s up with him? This terse, detached and self-isolated evolution intrigues me, and I guess that’s the point. The Autobot hierarchy is neatly encapsulated too: Prime, Hot Rod as I’m guessing the leader-in-waiting, then Ultra Magnus (in a role not unalike his previous IDW incarnation but demonstrably not so much the free agent) and Kup as the more openly gung ho military general. The Neo-Decepticons’ attack on the transmitter plays like the pre-credits sequence of a Bond movie and the final page is an OMG jaw-dropper.

In fact, one of the things I liked most was the kind of creepy, big brother-ish depiction of the Last Autobot. Watching over? Or just watching? You almost empathize with the Decepticon attack.

Plenty of intrigues: What is zero space? Who is this sort of omniscient narrator? (“We”? “Our?” – some sort of collective? Maybe a nod to the Valhalla-like J’nwan from Furman’s own fan fic/convention story ‘The Last Days of Optimus Prime?) And, of course, what happens next?

I’m hooked. Job done. Bring on #81…

[Professor Smooth]

Bumblemus speaks the truth.

Can we do less?

Sure, for some of us this may be surplus to requirements. Some of us want to accept that the G1 story is over...finished! But, looming over us like some vast, predatory bird, we have to accept that it never ends. We wanted this, and now we reap the whirlwind. And if it leaves some fans with the worst case of indigestion they've ever had, then maybe a short, sharp lesson was what they needed. Otherwise, what chance do we have?

I will read this... or die in the attempt!

This cannot- MUST not- continue!

I came.

[bumblemusprime]

I will read this... or die in the attempt!

This cannot- MUST not- continue!

I came.

Better to fight and die than live with the knowledge that you ran.

[snarl]

I enjoyed reading the row in this thread. Well played chaps, although could one of you just call the other one a ****?

I had actually thought to myself previously that Furman must have molested ID in a previous life or his dreams or something (or maybe did his mom), as to me, he [ID] does always seem to have too have the knives out for anything [SF] produces...

Anyway, I loved the Wildman Old Skool "shabby TFs", and although the art's not at the level of the end of the US run, I didn't think it was bad. I do however remember when he was drawing TWW and people came out and said Wildman's stuff was not great. Thought they were spouting a load of bollocks then and I do now.

I think the old 80s / early 90s style colouring seems to work well with it though.

Story - does the job.

[inflatable dalek]

I enjoyed reading the row in this thread. Well played chaps, although could one of you just call the other one a ****?

I think we're cool now, any beef I had with Steve (;) ) ended when he actually read the issue and was able to talk about why he liked it in a smart well reasoned way. I don't agree with him, but what he wrote there was much more endemic to good fun debate than what had gone before.

I had actually thought to myself previously that Furman must have molested ID in a previous life or his dreams or something (or maybe did his mom), as to me, he [ID] does always seem to have too have the knives out for anything [SF] produces...

My reviews for Escalation (infiltration pre-dated my taking up the mantle of the Bat) were mostly very positive, as were the bulk of the Spotlights. And I'm generally favourable towards the Titan comic (with the proviso I tend to go easy on it as that's the book specifically for young kids so the views of a 30 year old man on it are largely irrelevant). Overall, including everything, I think my comments on Furmans stuff work out as better than 50% positive. I don't know if the anti-reviews just stand out more because it's easier to write a good negative review than a good positive one (or so I tend to find) but the idea I'm constantly kicking him is a false one. Shane Bloody McCarthy got it far, far worse.

The end of Devastation was where I felt things began to go badly wrong. It's possible that Furman was already being forced to start changing plans (that was around the time AHM was announced after all) but he still stands by it as the story he wants to tell and it basically wobbles badly on many levels, including but not limited to the chickening out on the promise of any actual devastation (Runabout and Runamuck are killed but even the other characters don't care. Other than that it's Jazz -losses-an-arm-and-that's-about-it-tion). Don't get me started on the dead end Ironhide plot either, the page wasted promoting the Grimlock spotlight could easily have been given over to that, and as for the Reapers...

And then of course, things went badly wrong. A lot of which was out of Furman's control, but I still maintain that within the constraints offered he could have resolved things in a much more satisfying manner if the Spotlight characters for Revelation had been better chosen to reflect the main plot (Cyclonus is the best of the four by far and that's because he's actually properly integrated into events) and if Maximum Dinobots had either been four issues or if the Dealer plot had been resolved there to spare us the comedy padding with Swoop constantly changing his mind over if he gives a toss or not.

I have a lot of time and respect for Furman. But I think as a writer who works in fairly narrow tropes he's pretty much offered all he can and he can come across as a bit of a tit in interviews (much like Andrew Cartmel can on the Who DVD's) and I won't just accept everything he throws out regardless of quality just because he is Simon Furman. Anymore than I'll let Uncle Bob have a free pass for the terrible Movie adaptation he did just because of the huge and important early work he did on the franchise (and he comes across and one of the nicest people involved with Transformers in interviews. Doesn't make wrestling Micromasters any better).

The shame of Furman's IDW run is for the first time he had the chance to create things from the ground up exactly how he wanted. And eveything went tits up. And yes, there's lots of reasons for that but the writing plays a part in it as well.

To be more cheerful though: One of the things I really, really liked about 80.5 is the cast felt right for the later days of the comic. It would have been very easy to just focus on the "Famous" main G1 cast even though, say, Thundercracker is a nobody as far as Marvel is concerned. Spinster and company, even without lines, being front and centre in Soundwave's army is the sort of detail the book could have easily got wrong so it's nice to see it properly attended to. It creates the feeling it won't be forgotten that Krok second in command when Bludgeon's troops show up even if I doubt many people would have missed him if he wasn't there.

[The Last Autobot]

Read it as soon as it was available.

Pretty decent. And I just knew I would be killed in my first appearance after 21 years!!! (counting aside all the Modus Prime and minicon fest in TLA last actual fiction appearance).

[Impactor returns 2.0]

Can't the last autobot just rebuild himself?

[The Last Autobot]

Hope so!

But I guess having an almost invincible I-can-rebuild-all-your-fallen-autobots-instantaneously would be too much of an advantage.

[Predabot]

Lets do this bullet point style:

A: Yes, I do get enjoyment out of Transformers. The majority of my reviews at the Archive are positive, it was only after the comic hit a real long period of crap that I stopped both doing them and buying the comic.

B: TFA isn't some huge gestalt with everyone thinking the same. I didn't pay much attention to comments on the Costa run but there were posters who liked AHM very much (including this sites own Yaya. Though he seemed to change his mind the second issue 13 hit and declared the previous 12 suddenly crap. But that sort of wackiness is why we love him).

C: More Than Meets the Eye is great, and RID has been a fairly solid if flawed book. The worst issue for me this year, RID 4, mainly suffered from being a bit dull and is considerably better than the McCarthy crap that drove me off reading. I'm expecting IDW editorial (who I consider to be the source of most of the problems the company have had, "Hey, this guy who admits he doesn't get the characters, lets give him the Ongoing job!") to drop the ball sooner rather than later, I'm enjoying the ride whilst it lasts. The Dreamwave style "Months" we've got coming up look like a worrying wobble and IDW have never seemed able to cope with the fact they're only going to sell aprox 12K copies an issue no matter what leading to all sorts of stupid relaunches/abandoning of plans but I have faith in Roberts and think Barber is OK considering he's got the much harder book to write.

D: Did you miss the bit in the above post where I said nice things about MTMTE 4?

E: Have you actually read the issue? You don't make any comment on it but I'm really going to have to hope so (I didn't realise when I posted this thread it wasn't free comic book day till the 5th, my supplier must have just bunged it in with MTMTE 4 to save on postage, I guess you would have gotten yours the same way?) because you'd look pretty silly if you wind up reading it and going "Wow, this actually is crap". I mean, I offer reasons for my not enjoying the issue, you haven't been able to come up with anything to counter them or anything you enjoyed about it.

F: And you do realise the inherent irony in whining about whining? Indeed, as this is your one and only post at the time of writing that means 100% of your contribution to this site is moaning and borderline personal attacks about things no one is making you read.

And no, I won't be reading Regeneration 1. I gave the free issue a try and feel it wasn't worth what I paid for it. I'll stick with the Marvel continuation actually published by Marvel and feel no need to throw cash at two past their best creators going through their mid-life crisis (I really wish Wildman had stuck to his "I've had enough of Transformers and am resigning from it and this has nothing to do with the fact I'm not getting any work from it at the moment" announcement at AA a few years ago and Furman seems determined to prove he's Chris Clarermont).

I'm sure people both here and at TFA will enjoy it, and more power to them. Back and forth debate over the merits of an issue are always part of the fun of discussion boards (which is why it's great we don't all agree), but this is poor enough I've no desire to even pirate it to join in the debate.

There's nothing wrong with being a grumpy old git tho', Dalek.
It's ok... we could always use another git in our grumpy old convent.

Just accept who you are, and you'll be free.

Come now... I'll even let you try out the chief hat...

[Yaya]

Hey, anybody know where I might be able to read this online for free?

[bumblemusprime]

Hey, anybody know where I might be able to read this online for free?

I'm in the same boat.