Transformers: Dark of the Moon (Massive Spoilers)

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Thu May 26, 2011 9:05 pm

Much like the 2007 movie, we're not getting DotM until a month after its US release. Which means that (short of taking an international vacation to see a movie) there's absolutely no realistic way of avoiding spoilers. Fortunately, the Kindle version of Peter David's movie adaptation came out earlier this week. So I'm spoiling the movie for myself before I can be spoiled by somebody else.

I'm about half-way through and I must admit, I really like what I've read so far. Mikaela has left Sam because she basically "can't deal with all of this." So Sam's started dating Carly and they live together. Along with Wheelie and a new mini-annoying Transformer called Brains. Sam is kind of pissed that he "saved the world" but can't get a job. The government paid for his college, but wouldn't give him a job with NEST because, honestly, he's completely unqualified.

Blah, blah, blah, human stuff.

Optimus Prime gets pissed off when he finds that the Ark crashed on the moon in the 60s and the humans knew about it. The 'bots travel to the moon to recover what they can of the ship, it's pilot (Sentinel Prime), and the cargo (space bridge platforms).

Using the Matrix, Optimus revives Sentinel, who goes out into the world to try to understand the new planet the Autobots have found peace on.

We learn that Megatron has not come close to healing from the wounds he suffered in RotF. His transformation takes almost a full minute, is painful to watch, and he bleeds during and after the process. The leaking Energon is used to feed some small Cybertronian hatchlings as well as a new Transformer (described as a psychotic head on spider legs) called Igor.

Sam is attacked by Laserbeak (who will either be awesome or annoying on film. It's hard to tell. and finds that the Decepticons found the crash site first and recovered a LOT of space bridge platforms. However, they can't operate them without Sentinel Prime, who is the "key to all of this."

Sam, Bumblebee, Simmons, and a few other bots go out to bring Sentinel back (for protection) but get ambushed by the Decepticon "Dreads." Basically Predacons with car alt-modes. The bots pretty much clean house, and Sentinel is brought back to the base, safely.

Optimus meets with the President.

At the NEST base, Sam tells Sentinel Prime that he's the key to this. Sentinel responds that he knows and always has been. He also knows that there was no way the Autobots would ever win the war, and has reached a deal with Megatron. Then he kill Ironhide and Skids. Mudflap goes nuts on Sentinel Prime, allowing the others enough time to escape before being destroyed.

Prime gets the news and tells the President to run and hide, before heading back to NEST.

Full disclosure: There's some pretty bad stuff with Sam's parents. I'm leaving that part out because, who here cares?

Post by **Kaylee** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:10 pm

>> I'm about half-way through and I must admit, I really like what I've read so far

Really? You don't sound particularly rivetted by it!

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Thu May 26, 2011 10:57 pm

It feels very Transformer-comic-like. Maybe not Simon, but definitely not Mike, or Mick. Bob. With a hint of Chris.

Post by **Kaylee** » Fri May 27, 2011 6:07 am

Professor Smooth wrote:It feels very Transformer-comic-like. Maybe not Simon, but definitely not Mike, or Mick. Bob. With a hint of Chris.

How nice

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Fri May 27, 2011 12:29 pm

I'm more than halfway through, and there's still no sign of "the Wreckers."

Also: I can see why they wanted to keep Soundwave's Earth-based alt-mode a secret.

Quick comment: I am genuinely interested in Sam this time around.

Remember that "Pretender" Decepticon chick that tried to get with Sam in RotF? Neither does anybody else, it would seem.

In fact, DotM kiiiiiiiind of disregards a LOT of RotF stuff. Like, all but the bare essentials.

Sort of want to go buy a few toys for the movie (beyond Megs and Prime, which I buy (and later sell) every time a new movie is released.)

Oh, speaking of Megs: I LOVE this version of Movie Megatron. It's something I don't think we've EVER seen outside of the comics (and even that's reaching) but it WORKS.

Shockwave. The "big bad" of this movie. Right? He's appeared on like 2 pages so far. He was driving that tentacle monster, Action Master style.

Seriously, I dig this story like crazy. Here's hoping it's not just Peter David's writing that's keeping it good.

The Last Autobot · Post by **The Last Autobot** » Fri May 27, 2011 3:15 pm

Well Sentinel is the real bad guy so I really like how all the mkt points SW.

A lot of people will be surprised.

bumblemusprime · Post by **bumblemusprime** » Fri May 27, 2011 3:38 pm

I'm guessing it's Peter David's writing. Sorry dude. This is the guy who made Shatterstar an interesting character. Who took the concept of "Spider-Man 2099" and made it a far better comic than any of the Spider-Man comics of the time. Who introduced a smaller, punier Hulk who we collectively loved. Etc. Peter David kicks all kindsa ass. Too bad he didn't write the actual movie.

Post by **Best First** » Fri May 27, 2011 4:37 pm

i might get this just cos it's probably the only chance to see Peter D do TFs.

And, for the record i do remember the Pretender Lady. I remember googling her as well...

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Sat May 28, 2011 12:23 pm

I finished the book just now:

The battle in Chicago sounds epic. Here's a brief overview of the rest of the story.

The combined governments of the world exile the Autobots (sound familiar? Megatron's Master Plan, anyone) and they abide by the wishes of humanity. Starscream blows up their shuttle. Megatron, Shockwave, and Sentinel open up a space bridge that will bring Cybertron to Earth (sound familiar? Ultimate Doom?)

But, wait! The Autobots aren't dead! They expected the attack and prepared for it.

Wheeljack dies, but not before giving Sam some cool weapons. Sam uses those weapons to kill Starscream. This leads to Soundwave capturing the (non Optimus) Autobots which leads to Bumblebee killing Soundwave.

Sentinel gets pissed at Megatron and basically bitch slaps him off a building.

Everything comes down to Optimus Prime vs Sentinel and things aren't going well for Optimus. Fortunately, Megatron interferes, helps Prime to his feet, and the two take out Sentinel Prime.

At the end of the fight, Megatron collapses and yields to Optimus, basically admitting that after all these years of fighting, nothing's been gained. He promises to take the Decepticons back to Cybertron to rebuild and tells Prime that, when the Autobots are ready to return, there will finally be peace.

Sam, with the help of Bumblebee, proposes to Carly.

There is a typo in the book that is absolutely INFURIATING. As Megatron helps Optimus to his feet in preparation for the battle with Sentinel, Megatron says, "Two shall stand; one shall fall." But in the book, it's written "THREE shall stand." I do hope that somebody got some heat for that one.

I'm really looking forward to seeing this on the big screen. It seems like a well-rounded story. If anything, I'm sure the novel will help me to understand the backstory that Michael Bay will have glossed over in favor of more explosions.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat May 28, 2011 12:37 pm

Professor Smooth wrote:There is a typo in the book that is absolutely INFURIATING. As Megatron helps Optimus to his feet in preparation for the battle with Sentinel, Megatron says, "Two shall stand; one shall fall." But in the book, it's written "THREE shall stand." I do hope that somebody got some heat for that one.

How can it say in the book BOTH "Two shall..." AND "Three shall..." ?

And wouldn't it be "Three..." anyway, seeing as there's THREE of them?

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Sat May 28, 2011 3:06 pm

Rebis wrote:
Professor Smooth wrote:There is a typo in the book that is absolutely INFURIATING. As Megatron helps Optimus to his feet in preparation for the battle with Sentinel, Megatron says, "Two shall stand; one shall fall." But in the book, it's written "THREE shall stand." I do hope that somebody got some heat for that one.
How can it say in the book BOTH "Two shall..." AND "Three shall..." ?

And wouldn't it be "Three..." anyway, seeing as there's THREE of them?

It's meant to say, "Two shall stand (Prime/Megs), one shall fall(Sentinel)." But the book says "THREE shall stand (Prime/Megs/mouse in pocket?), one shall fall (probably still Sentinel).

I like that the story ends with peace between the Autobots and Decepticons, rather than one side (prrrrrrrrobably the 'cons) completely destroyed. It leaves the story open for future sequels, while providing a nice ending in the event that doesn't happen.

Now. If you'll excuse me. I have TOYS to buy!

Sunyavadin · Post by **Sunyavadin** » Sat May 28, 2011 3:27 pm

Cool. Now I can sit back, relax, completely ignore this film, and "borrow" a copy once the rifftrax dub comes out.

Wait a second, that's exactly the same thing as I did LAST TIME.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Sat May 28, 2011 3:34 pm

So a positive review of the story from somebody who's been a Transformers fan from the very beginning and an "online" Transformers fan since the mid-90s isn't enough to get you to see the flick?

That's sad.

I should follow through on my project.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat May 28, 2011 4:07 pm

Professor Smooth wrote:
Rebis wrote:
Professor Smooth wrote:There is a typo in the book that is absolutely INFURIATING. As Megatron helps Optimus to his feet in preparation for the battle with Sentinel, Megatron says, "Two shall stand; one shall fall." But in the book, it's written "THREE shall stand." I do hope that somebody got some heat for that one.
How can it say in the book BOTH "Two shall..." AND "Three shall..." ?

And wouldn't it be "Three..." anyway, seeing as there's THREE of them?
It's meant to say, "Two shall stand (Prime/Megs), one shall fall(Sentinel)." But the book says "THREE shall stand (Prime/Megs/mouse in pocket?), one shall fall (probably still Sentinel).

It's only meant to say that if you're following the lines of "It's a quote from the animated movie!" where "One shall stand" and "One shall fall" is the outcome of the fight.

If, as could be interpreted, Megatron is referring to both the initial and final states of the fight, "Three shall stand" at the beginning and "One shall fall" by the end.

Alternatively, as the trailers of the film seem to show Prime still 'wearing' Jetfire, that could be a possible explanation for the three.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Sat May 28, 2011 11:03 pm

Rebis wrote:
Alternatively, as the trailers of the film seem to show Prime still 'wearing' Jetfire, that could be a possible explanation for the three.

That is never even hinted at. Although it does seem that the Jetwing Prime and Ultimate (combined w/ trailer) Prime are different.

Sunyavadin · Post by **Sunyavadin** » Sat May 28, 2011 11:37 pm

Optimus....Jetfire?
http://tfwiki.net/w2/images2/f/fe/Jetfire-Dutch.jpg

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:22 pm

I really enjoyed the film.

But then I liked the previous ones, so whatevs.

Spoilers follow, obvs.

A lot of the flaws are still there -it's still a Michael Bay film (incidentally, a Bay sunset in 3D is awesome), there's still a lot of emphasis on the human characters, though not so much, Wheelie's in it still... that sort of stuff.

But you know all those fanbois who whined about how there wasn't enough bone crunching nightmare fuel destruction in the first one? Yeah, they can't say that about this one. Jesus H. A bit Terminator Salvationesque in parts, but I forgive it.

Shockwave had a much smaller role than I expected, but I love his Tremors Worm pet thing. Laserbeak is quality. Even Barricade pops up!

Liked the slow reveal of the plot... took me a while to piece it together in a way that made sense (why do they need the spacebridge to get to Earth... oh no, they don't... it's to get the resources to Cybertron... oh, wait, no, it's The Ultimate Doom. And I love the fact that the plot is basically the Ultimate Doom. Though some form of gravitational disturbance would have been nice... even the cartoon managed that.

Not sure about the Trek references nodding to Nimoy's involvement. Borderline nice/cringey.

A minor continuity handwave about Prime's matrix, but I'll forgive it as the end result is the same. And a Decepticon army hiding on the moon since the 60s helps explain where they were all coming from in the previous two. Just no need to bring them all down when a) Megatron was missing and b) the main plan still wasn't actionable.

The Wreckers were naff, though fortunately their involvement was pretty much minimal. Killing off Q was obvious, given he was the one we don't care about, but then they also offed Ironhide, so I suppose it evens out.

Stunned by the fact they killed Starscream, Soundwave, Shockwave AND Megatron.* Christ knows what they'll do for a fourth film. Hopefully nothing.

Tons of brainless robot on robot human-led action carnage. WOOHA.

And whoever decided to introduce Rosie Huntington Whitely arse-first is a genius.

Smoothster - in the novelisation, is the shuttle the Autobots use to go to the moon the same one they launch off from when being exiled?

[EDIT] And Prime isn't wearing Jetfire. There's no outright explanation for where the jetpack came from, but it clearly is just that. Maybe it's from his weapons trailer, maybe it's from Q's stash. But it's clearly just a jetpack.

[EDIT 2] And Sam doesn't propose to Carly. Bumblebee just wants him to.

[EDIT 3] Oh, and Alan Tudyk. ALAN ******* TUDYK. Didn't know he was in it. Absolute gold. As always. GOLD. Always believe in your soul.

*[EDIT 4, as I read the thread properly] Yes, Megatron dies. After interfering in the battle between Primes, he says to Optimus "what would you be without me?" to which OP responds "let's find out" and rips his head off.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 11:22 am

I kinda dig that the movie and novelization are so separate. Although I'm almost kicking myself for reading spoilers of the actual movie. Weird.

In the novel, the Autobots don't use the same ship. The ship's explained away as the one that brought the new RotF Autobots to Earth.

bumblemusprime · Post by **bumblemusprime** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:58 pm

Heh. Shia LaBeouf is going to be the next Clint Eastwood of Hollywood lady bombs.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/gossip/ ... ?track=rss

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:05 pm

Probably could have phrased the question better. In the film they're like "our ship can get us to the moon quickly!" then later on Frances McDormand is all like "we're sending them away in the ship that brought the second wave, we've hooked it up to a shuttle to get it to launch."

It doesn't quite track properly, as it's a bit "well... why do you need to do that when they've already got a ship that can get them to the moon?"

Eh.

Other stuff as I skim the thread:

- Igor. Not really mentioned/addressed in the film. He's in about two scenes, but he's just sort of there.

Sounds like the Sentinel/Optimus/Megatron stuff unfolds quite differently in the book.

The basics are there, but it's more Sentinel is absolutely caning Optimus (even chopping an arm off) until Megatron interferes, having been victim to some psychology from Carly (about how he's just Sentinel's bitch).

Megs gives SP a proper kicking, makes the aforementioned comment to OP (comes across as a good old "rivals bringing out the best of each other" comment) leading to Optimus ripping his head clean off (with one arm, as mentioned) which is just brutally cool.

Sentinel, battered and humbled, kneeling on the ground, apologises to Optimus about how he let everyone down. OP gives the old "no, you let yourself down" response (or words to that effect) before raising his gun and just executing the old sod.

In case the previous murders of Bonecrusher and the Fallen didn't hammer it home, Movie Optimus Prime is NOT your father's Autobot. Pragmatic and brutal. And this is after he's killed Shockwave by ripping his eyeball out through his face.

The movie in general is a bit long though and sags through the first third due to limited big robots fighting and too much humans wandering around doing people stuff.

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:08 pm

bumblemusprime wrote:Heh. Shia LaBeouf is going to be the next Clint Eastwood of Hollywood lady bombs.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/gossip/ ... ?track=rss

Well, let's be honest, you would. Alright she's anorexic, has a miserable face and is apparantly a daft stroppy diva, but if she was there it'd be rude not to.

Well, I would.

Sunyavadin · Post by **Sunyavadin** » Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:28 pm

Other interesting tidbits from a professional Biotechnologist -

"Jetprime" is the name of a transfection reagent.

This post was officially more interesting than the film.

IronHide · Post by **IronHide** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 2:03 am

Why does every continuity insist on killing of Ironhide.....goddammit....

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 11:15 am

I guess, once they've killed Prime at least once, they need to kill someone else for a bit of variety, y'know?

Mr_Tigg · Post by **Mr_Tigg** » Thu Jun 30, 2011 11:43 am

IronHide wrote:Why does every continuity insist on killing of Ironhide.....goddammit....

Seconded - not that it probably made much difference in the movie-verse. It's not like he was especially developed as a character. He just stands around in Revenge of the Fallen from recollection.

The movie sounds pretty bad from all the reviews I've read, but I'll go see it no doubt out of morbid-curiosity.

I REALLY hope this is the last Bayformers movie. Please, please, please reboot the franchise (as that's the current fashion) with a more considered director. I vote JJ Abrams or Bryan Singer!

inflatable dalek · Post by **inflatable dalek** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:36 pm

Brendocon wrote: [EDIT] And Prime isn't wearing Jetfire. There's no outright explanation for where the jetpack came from, but it clearly is just that. Maybe it's from his weapons trailer, maybe it's from Q's stash. But it's clearly just a jetpack.

When he loses the trailer he specifically says he needs it back for the flight equipment (on the toy it's actually made out of the trailer). Though oddly having set up this need they then don't follow it through and he then turns up with it again a few scenes later as if somethings been cut out (hmmmm).

Other than the sheer awesomeness of Keith Szarabajka playing Laserbeak my general thoughts:

Well, once again its starting to look like I'm going to be the lone voice of support for the film amongst my closest family and friends, of the two who've seen it so far about the best they've said for it is they could actually tell what was going on in the action scenes this time. They generally thought all the fun had been taken out of the films and it was too dull and serious apart from a few random moments.

Generally though, I liked it. Especially how it managed to pull off the tonal shift in showing the occupation of Chicago as a really nasty business with people dying and being generally distressed. Compared to the earlier car chase scene which continued the attitude of the first two of focusing on the cool stuff blowing up rather than any human cost (I mean, how many people would have died in that pile up?) it could have been real mood whiplash, but it still worked.

Cullen, Nimoy and LaBeouf all did the usual good work, the effects were stunning and well thought out (even if there wasn't really a forest fight moment) and the Chenobyl sequence was nicely evocative, even if I wasn't much of a fan of the "aliens did it" angle.

Middling niggles:

I didn't like the mixing of real footage with newsreel in the opening scenes, if only because it showed how much their Nixon and Kennedy stand ins didn't really look like the originals. Not a fan of the whole Apollo angle either, it seemed somewhat demeaning to a genuinely great achievement to suggest it was all to briefly look round a mysterious alien space ship, and I suspect Armstrong will be mildly embarrassed by the whole thing, unlike shameless attention whore Aldrin (and a man who wasn't trusted enough to be the first man off the lander because of his personal problems somehow got picked for a mission so secret he can never talk about it?). People less into the space program will probably not be so annoyed by that though.

And were the other two old NASA guys real people or just terrible actors?

Epps' subplot with rounding up the old NEST troopers felt fairly redundant, he could just as easily still been in active service and part of the advanced NEST scouting party with Sam. Surely he's not such a popular character they thought he needed his own mini-adventure?

The Decepticons having to be reminded by their human stooge they don't take prisoners was just... odd.

The outright bad:

Only two things really:

First, Carly was terrible.She was pretty much exactly what Megan Fox's worst critics accused her of. Insanely badly acted, spent the entire film screaming "SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM!" (it'd be interesting to see her have a shout off with Stacy "JAAAAAAAAMES!" Sutton from A View To A Kill) whilst managing to keep her mostly white outfit virtually spotless in a battlezone, and with none of the proactive go-getter spirit Mikaela had.

The second is Megatron was pretty much wasted again, meaning that in all three films they pretty much wasted Hugo Weaving. The bit where he and Carly (two characters who've never met before- and there's not even any indication prior to this she even knows what Megatron looks like) talk like old acquaintances and she manages to change his mind about his entire plan in about six words even when all his obvious prior doubts haven't done it is just bizarre, did a bit from a draft with Fox in not get rewritten here? And him deciding to kill Sentinel just before he finishes off Optimus was especially daft, just wait three seconds man.

I'd have probably given Megs the Shockwave role to beef up his part, make the deal between him and Sentinel more even and give him some decent action scenes so him managing to kill SP so easily wouldn't have come out of left field to such an extent.

On a minor note, with Barricade back and the overall sense of the end of an era it might have been nice if it had been him rather than Starscream in the "My eye!" fight, it would have created a sense of things coming full circle to have Sam and Bumblebee up against the Con who first brought them together, and then off Starscream another way. Though that's minor as I also like the way that bit turned out.

Post by **spiderfrommars** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:22 am

I liked it, and more than the last one. These films get by for me by 1) realising big transforming robots fighting in all their glory and 2) Shia and the human gang keeping the quips coming fast. Rosie couldn't act for toffee but I'm siding with her over Megan purely on account of her nationality. Killing off ALL of the cool characters at the end seemed a huge waste, and I'm a bit tired of movie Optimus executing his opponents like some kind of mechanoid Rambo. But I had a lot of goodwill for what was a fun film, admittedly gradually eroded by the overlong final battle.

Post by **Kaylee** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:20 am

Does 'offing' characters have much relevance in the movies? They seem to return almost randomly (particularly Decepticons). Or at least that's my impression. Probably due to my inability to tell any of the Decepticons apart, except Starscream (who has wings!) and Megatron (who doesn't!).

Post by **spiderfrommars** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:47 am

Dunno, I think decapitations and exploding heads are a way of writing characters out in the movieverse. Heck, in any verse.

Post by **Kaylee** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 8:30 am

spiderfrommars wrote:Dunno, I think decapitations and exploding heads are a way of writing characters out in the movieverse. Heck, in any verse.

Tell that to Starscream's Ghost, any-continuity Unicron, Prime's disembodied Marvel bonce or Megatron mooching straight back into TF2 after being obliterated by the All Spark in TF1