Moderators:Best First, spiderfrommars, IronHide
I think Simon used "been and burned" two other times.Best First wrote: I'm intrigued as to this notion that 'burn' is a persistant SF cliche - care to provide any examples to support the usual sweeping assertions?
Kup was full of internal dialogue, but it actually enhanced the storytelling. It was meaningful text.The notion that he doesn't allow the art to tell the story is frankly bollocks, compare the amount if text in this to the KUu issue which you wet your pants about, and look at scenes like Prime's stopping of the truck with the fake streaker on it in issue 2 or Ironhide's exit from the building this issue for example - EJ is given plenty of room to breathe.
Probably my favorite moment in the comic, I agree.Oh, and size changing avatars was quality.
Best First wrote:I thought we could just meander between making well thought out points, being needlessly immature, provocative and generalist, then veer into caring about constructive debate and make a few valid points, act civil for a bit, then lower the tone again, then act offended when we get called on it, then dictate what it is and isn't worth debating, reinterpret a few of my own posts through a less offensive lens, then jaunt down whatever other path our seemingly volatile mood took us in.
or its charcaterisation that shows us that Blitzwing revels in violence, you might have as point if Simon was indulging in Clairemont levels of dialogue, but he isn't.Yaya wrote:[
Simon's problem is actually more about when he uses his dialogue inappropriately. In most scenes involving a "WHAM!" kind of moment, instead of just letting the action speak for itself, the character has to always make some cute sarcastic remark which I feel just takes away from the moment. Like when Blitzwing shot Ratchet in Infiltration, he makes some cute remark, whereas had he had said nothing, it would have been more effective. There are multiple instances where the absence of any dialogue whatsoever would have been better.
Maybe they are though - they are all essentially grunts/thugs, Skywarp and Blitzwing definitely. You will note Thundercracker probably doesn't get those kind of lines and just seems to get on with the job more, then you have got Runabout and Runamuck's linguistic quirk, to so in fact to say all teh Deceps are the same, rather than that some are similar in a manner unsuprising in the lower ranks of an army that clearly has little respect for life and probably contains a lot of quite thuggish individuals, is also off the mark.Simon uses those cute sarcastic comments way too much with the Decepticons in particular, to the point where they all seem to have the same snide personality. They all seem to be rubbing their palms together quipping "Oh, yes!" Really, what have we seen so far in the dialogue that separates Astrotrain, Blitzwing, Skywarp, and Thundercracker? They all seem cut from the same mold.
er, why is he forced to? He's the writer. Its not on to criticse him for how he handles cetain characters but then not credit him when he writes in a way you do like, rather attributing it to him being 'forced'.That's why Soundwave, Ravage, and Shockwave have always been a breath of fresh air to me, because Simon is forced to stay in character with them.
I knew there was somewhere else he used "Burn!".Shanti418 wrote:THe vision was a bit weird, but I look at it as "Simon beginning to lay the seeds for the more metaphysical aspects of TF which we all loved the s*** out in the Marvel days"
But it is my opinion, not really an argument. Others seem to have no problem with Furmanesque dialogue tendencies. I really didn't either until they became repetitious over the years.Just saying 'it would have been more effective' is not an arguement - you have to say why. Well you don't have to, but it would help if you want people to listen to your opinions.
I'm not saying there isn't any room for criticism, I'm just saying that compared to the "ground beef" of DW comics and the "Kidz Meaty Treats" of the Armada/Energon/Cybertron, what IDW is doing now is filet mignon, so if it's a little overcooked, I'm still going to give my compliments to the chef.Yaya wrote: So I respect Simon for what he has managed to accomplish, but still feel there is room for editorial suggestion in the dialogue department.
Best First wrote:I thought we could just meander between making well thought out points, being needlessly immature, provocative and generalist, then veer into caring about constructive debate and make a few valid points, act civil for a bit, then lower the tone again, then act offended when we get called on it, then dictate what it is and isn't worth debating, reinterpret a few of my own posts through a less offensive lens, then jaunt down whatever other path our seemingly volatile mood took us in.
Best First wrote:[quote="Yaya]
I will say that it's not just me, however. There are other fans, a minority yes, who have complained about the dialogue.
No, the reason I bring this up is to basically say it's not a personal quirk of mine to be bothered by such dialogue, others have felt the same way. When there are more than one, then maybe Simon should pay some heed to it, try something different and see how it works.i'd actually have far more respect for your opinion if you didn't feel the need to try and bolster it with such statements to be honest.
I would agree, I think IDW has done a much better job handling the license than DW ever did, from top to bottom. They have been more professional as a company, the quality of their product is better, and they are very consistent.I'm not saying there isn't any room for criticism, I'm just saying that compared to the "ground beef" of DW comics and the "Kidz Meaty Treats" of the Armada/Energon/Cybertron, what IDW is doing now is filet mignon, so if it's a little overcooked, I'm still going to give my compliments to the chef.
With apologies to vegetarians.
What?! War and Peace was ******* ****!Yaya wrote:Best First wrote:[quote="Yaya]
I will say that it's not just me, however. There are other fans, a minority yes, who have complained about the dialogue.No, the reason I bring this up is to basically say it's not a personal quirk of mine to be bothered by such dialogue, others have felt the same way. When there are more than one, then maybe Simon should pay some heed to it, try something different and see how it works.i'd actually have far more respect for your opinion if you didn't feel the need to try and bolster it with such statements to be honest.
I would agree, I think IDW has done a much better job handling the license than DW ever did, from top to bottom. They have been more professional as a company, the quality of their product is better, and they are very consistent.I'm not saying there isn't any room for criticism, I'm just saying that compared to the "ground beef" of DW comics and the "Kidz Meaty Treats" of the Armada/Energon/Cybertron, what IDW is doing now is filet mignon, so if it's a little overcooked, I'm still going to give my compliments to the chef.
With apologies to vegetarians.
For example, there are things I loved about DW, but they were all too often hit or miss. For every War and Peace, there was a Micromasters. If you look back at my reviews of what IDW has produced thus far, it's hard to find something that I rated less than a "B-", and I'm a pretty harsh critic, I like to think. In fact, aside from the Sixshot Spotlight and that last issue of Hearts of Steel, I can't really complain. The Shockwave and Kup Spotlights have been ones for the ages.
Oh, sorry, i thought it was just a boorish net tactic that anyone can use to try and inflate the importance of their own opinion.Yaya wrote:Best First wrote:[quote="Yaya]
I will say that it's not just me, however. There are other fans, a minority yes, who have complained about the dialogue.No, the reason I bring this up is to basically say it's not a personal quirk of mine to be bothered by such dialogue, others have felt the same way. When there are more than one, then maybe Simon should pay some heed to it, try something different and see how it works.i'd actually have far more respect for your opinion if you didn't feel the need to try and bolster it with such statements to be honest.
Best First wrote:I thought we could just meander between making well thought out points, being needlessly immature, provocative and generalist, then veer into caring about constructive debate and make a few valid points, act civil for a bit, then lower the tone again, then act offended when we get called on it, then dictate what it is and isn't worth debating, reinterpret a few of my own posts through a less offensive lens, then jaunt down whatever other path our seemingly volatile mood took us in.
You thought wrong, my friend.Best First wrote:Oh, sorry, i thought it was just a boorish net tactic that anyone can use to try and inflate the importance of their own opinion.Yaya wrote:Best First wrote:[quote="Yaya]
I will say that it's not just me, however. There are other fans, a minority yes, who have complained about the dialogue.No, the reason I bring this up is to basically say it's not a personal quirk of mine to be bothered by such dialogue, others have felt the same way. When there are more than one, then maybe Simon should pay some heed to it, try something different and see how it works.i'd actually have far more respect for your opinion if you didn't feel the need to try and bolster it with such statements to be honest.
Yaya wrote:You thought wrong, my friend.Best First wrote:Oh, sorry, i thought it was just a boorish net tactic that anyone can use to try and inflate the importance of their own opinion.Yaya wrote: No, the reason I bring this up is to basically say it's not a personal quirk of mine to be bothered by such dialogue, others have felt the same way. When there are more than one, then maybe Simon should pay some heed to it, try something different and see how it works.
Best First wrote:I thought we could just meander between making well thought out points, being needlessly immature, provocative and generalist, then veer into caring about constructive debate and make a few valid points, act civil for a bit, then lower the tone again, then act offended when we get called on it, then dictate what it is and isn't worth debating, reinterpret a few of my own posts through a less offensive lens, then jaunt down whatever other path our seemingly volatile mood took us in.
