Affiliation and Autobrand

[Guest]

So, following Marvel #1 (whether US or UK), all Transformers started life as these robots called Autobots. Then Megatron came along and started his rebel faction that he called Decepticons. To distinguish themselves, the Decepticons all got to wear little badges with a pointy purple face on it, the Deceptibrand, if you will.

So why do the Autobots wear a red face badge, and why do they need Autobranding? To distinguish themselves from Decepticons? No. They can do that by not wearing a Deceptibrand.

Maybe its to distinguish themselves from the non-combatants. But why would they do that? So the Decepticons know who to shoot at?

There is another aspect that needs looking at, though. Transformation.

Megatron created the transformation so that his Decepticons would have an edge over the Autobots. The Autobots, similarly, developed transformation of their own to better counter the Decepticon threat.

So, perhaps the Autobrand was to signify a transforming Autobot rather than a non-transforming one. But, if that's so, where then does the piano guy from Target:2006 come in? And what about Xaaron/Primus/Priest's claim that Primus made them transform to emulate Unicron's ability?

[BB Shockwave]

Umm... Because when some guys whose name I always forgot (wasn't even Budiasnky) threw together the first Marvel G1 comic, didn't really give it thought?

I can safely say we should take the later info from the comics as canon. Thus, everyone could transform (but propably not into war machines, hence the cons reconfiguration), everyone was an Autobot. Later as the war started, maybe people who wanted to be left alone got rid of the Autobrand and started claiming themselves to be neutral. And thus the 'Autobots' now meant the army opposing the Decepticons.

Note how many important TFs don't wear Autobrands - Xaaron doesn't, the Keeper doesn't, or any of the 'elders' who helped Prime with his Matrix vision in G2.

I'd like the idea that the Autobots were merely a faction created to uphold peace like the police force, but the G1 comic clearly states at some points that everyone was an Autobot once.

[KingMob]

So why do the Autobots wear a red face badge, and why do they need Autobranding? To distinguish themselves from Decepticons? No. They can do that by not wearing a Deceptibrand.

Maybe its to distinguish themselves from the non-combatants. But why would they do that? So the Decepticons know who to shoot at?

Taking it as a given that the Decepticons would be shooting at everyone who isn't on their side or could be suubjugated - they show scant regard for neutrals/Empties/dudes like Boltax/aliens - perhaps, yeah, the Autobrand is more akin to a badge denoting Autobot military.
Perhaps the Rite and assorted rigmarole that is associated with it was part of an attempt to 'gung-ho-ise' or nobilse the concept of giving up pacifistic beliefs and archiving data or whatever and switching to drawing a weapon and going out to get shot at.
A largely volunteer army needs some kind of symbol to get behind.

And then after donkey's years of war, pretty much all the Autobots left are the ones doing the fighting. The few unbranded Autobots left never joined the official military - we see politicians and religious peeps without it - but due to being a society whose existence is largely dominated by war, the concept of being an Autobot is now pretty much defined by wearing the badge, even tho unbadged TFs can still be Autobots by default.

Transformation thing, dunno. Again, yes, perhaps it should be thought of that Megs was the first to create modes designed purely for combat and destruction and reformatted his Decepticons along those lines, forcing the Autobot armed forces to similarly give up pacifistic modes and take on combat abilities, or at least modes that aren't inert or useless in a war situation.

If they couldn't Transform until Megs, were they still called Transformers before then? Or did someone like buckethead come up with that race-wide name as well?

[spiderfrommars]

The Autobrand differentiates them from Neutralists, but is an oath and a symbol more than anything I guess.

I'm open to the theory that Megs was the first to enhance alt. modes into battle configurations, rather than invent 'Transformers' outright.

Primus envisioned his race to mimic Unicron's ability. This may have taken eons of evolution, and before the Decepticons rose to power it may have been the case that not all Autobots had (or needed the ability).

[Best First]

Note how many important TFs don't wear Autobrands - Xaaron doesn't

its on his inner thigh - i've seen it.

[The Last Autobot]

At the beggining everyone was an "autobot" so there was no need of symbols to differentiate anybody cause all are one . When Megatron makes a splinter faction he wanted to make a stand and be aside of the rest so he creates the decepticon symbol (or maybe he thinks so, but its a reminiscense of previous disconformity from waaaay back to Liege Maximo). Thus the badge is a cultural way of saying "I believe in this new way of seeing things, in the decepticon values".

After the first battles and losses. The autobots in a need of a uniting spirit behind -and seeing that their former "brothers" are killing them- copied (or maybe used a prior symbol) and branded themselves, adding more importance to their autobot heritage and being an autobot. Many didnt care a bit, and evaded the situation or simply denied it (although for a while). And stayed as neutrals.

As the war raged on. As years passed autobot and decepticon became synomimous to the fighters in this endless struggle and the rest (all the most probably remaining neutral, empties or recently created robots not fit to help to the war efforts) were simply "cybertronians".

Xaaron not having a badge could mean that he desperatly wanted a planet in which war wasnt present. Although he was amidst it and kenw that it was in his hands to make all he could to achieve that goal. And at the end setting things right.

[spiderfrommars]

We have the Last Autobot. Is the Decepticon insignia based on anyone? Does the Ultimate Warrior exist?

[Legion]

We have the Last Autobot. Is the Decepticon insignia based on anyone? Does the Ultimate Warrior exist?

It's not based on anyone that i'm aware of to be honest.
And i thought that The Last Autobot pretty much confirms that the Ultimate Warrior was just a pervesion on the legends about him, but i could be wrong, been a while since i read that issue.

[spiderfrommars]

We have the Last Autobot. Is the Decepticon insignia based on anyone? Does the Ultimate Warrior exist?

It's not based on anyone that i'm aware of to be honest.

Not in canon no, but does it follow Megs would choose the face of someone gone before?

[Legion]

We have the Last Autobot. Is the Decepticon insignia based on anyone? Does the Ultimate Warrior exist?

It's not based on anyone that i'm aware of to be honest.

Not in canon no, but does it follow Megs would choose the face of someone gone before?

ah, see what you mean. yes, yes it does. maybe a small flicker of influence from the Leige maybe? (i'm guessing the Leige would have had the G2 Con logo somewhere about him (maybe his original face before becoming that big bloated thing)). Megs had some sort of hint of that and used it to create the original con logo?

[/clutching at straws]

[spiderfrommars]

maybe his original face before becoming that big bloated thing

Maybe! Not that Megs would have any memory, but there could have been old texts with his image in and so on.

[Legion]

maybe his original face before becoming that big bloated thing

Maybe! Not that Megs would have any memory, but there could have been old texts with his image in and so on.

i didn't mean memory as in a recollection of a first hand event kind of memory, but some sort of instinctive/race memory, esp if Megs was somehow 'related' to the Leige as was hinted at...

[Metal Vendetta]

I like to think Soundwave designed it, after all it looks like him.

[snarl]

I'd say Shcokwave did it, but that would be silly.

I agree with the idea that the LM probably looked a bit like that and metally influenced Megsy somehow.

Also of the opinion that LM is the Ultimate Warrior bloke, i.e. the Con pinup. I would suggest that most know dick all about him though, i.e. they dont even entertain the thought that there is an almost god like dude that they're derived from and just in it on the back of Megatron.

[Legion]

Also of the opinion that LM is the Ultimate Warrior bloke, i.e. the Con pinup. I would suggest that most know dick all about him though, i.e. they dont even entertain the thought that there is an almost god like dude that they're derived from and just in it on the back of Megatron.

Hmm could well be!!

So, who'd win in a fight? The LM or tLA?

[Impactor returns 2.0]

I would think with the regen power tLA has he would win, maybe if you chop his head of it stops working, or somthin...

[Guest]

They're kind've the embodiments of life and death in a sense, just a few rungs down the ladder from Primus and Unicron.

Hmm...

Primus vs Unicron.
Last Autobot vs Liege Maximo.
Prime vs 'Tron.
Gears vs Frenzy?
Robot Master vs The Mechanic?

[BB Shockwave]

Robot Master vs The Mechanic?

Don't even go there...

Just out of curiosity, did Simon specify that the Last Autobot has a symbol-head, or did Andrew Wildman make him like that?

And btw, if the cartoon extravaganza known as DW's G1 comic would have continued, we'd have propably found out where the con symbol came from, seeing the manyflasbacks to Megs finding some ancient Con/Bot statues and texts... (of japanese toys, yeah... )

[man-with-the-dogs]

So, following Marvel #1 (whether US or UK), all Transformers started life as these robots called Autobots. Then Megatron came along and started his rebel faction that he called Decepticons. To distinguish themselves, the Decepticons all got to wear little badges with a pointy purple face on it, the Deceptibrand, if you will.

So why do the Autobots wear a red face badge, and why do they need Autobranding? To distinguish themselves from Decepticons? No. They can do that by not wearing a Deceptibrand.

Maybe its to distinguish themselves from the non-combatants. But why would they do that? So the Decepticons know who to shoot at?

There is another aspect that needs looking at, though. Transformation.

Megatron created the transformation so that his Decepticons would have an edge over the Autobots. The Autobots, similarly, developed transformation of their own to better counter the Decepticon threat.

So, perhaps the Autobrand was to signify a transforming Autobot rather than a non-transforming one. But, if that's so, where then does the piano guy from Target:2006 come in? And what about Xaaron/Primus/Priest's claim that Primus made them transform to emulate Unicron's ability?

yeah, but how could they have possibly been AUTOBOTS if they didn't transform into automobiles at that point? this is why i've always found the concept of the early autobots(the ancestors) turning into planes and spaceships really annoying.

[KingMob]

yeah, but how could they have possibly been AUTOBOTS if they didn't transform into automobiles at that point?

Maybe they noticed they were automatic robots?
Exploring just 'auto' as a root, you can get several pleasing results if you consider it means 'self'.
To our definition they're self-aware robots, independent mechanical systems.
That are fighting for their right to remain so, conceptually. They want to remain autonomous and free from Decepticon slavery/extermination.

Xaaron was a wily old wordsmith.