If you could make a new G1 cartoon, what would it be like?

[Uberking Robert]

You can do anything you want with it. You can have total creative control. For the purpose of this, Chris Latta and that guy who voiced Ultra Magnus have magically come back from the dead. And so has Lorenzo Music (not for any apparent reason).


How I'd do it:
1. The Transformers would be in-character. Optimus Prime wouldn't have any problem killing and Megatron wouldn't inexplicably let a fleshling go (in one scene in the old American G1 cartoon Megatron let some human live for some reason. That's certainly not very evil of him).

2. There's some character development and a certain number of characters are focused on but there's still a cast of hundreds.

3. Every time the Autobots and Decepticons do battle there are for some reason a whole bunch of random robot extras on each side who get killed so that we know the battle is actually dangerous, but none of the named characters that have personalities, histories and backgrounds croak unless it's a special episode.

5. The human characters have names that actually make sense, not "Spike" or "Sparkplug".

6. Basically, the cast of "main" robots (ones with personalities, histories and backgrounds) is not as limited; it includes every character that was shown in the US cartoon and US comic book, and every character who had his own toy.

7. Some characters aren't there, such as Wheelie and the female Autobots (what's the point? Why do they need female robots if Transformers can't sexually reproduce? I have no intention of implementing any political correctness).

8. How powerful the characters are and what they can do is consistent. So Autobots don't for some reason suddenly have the ability to fly (although that was one of the things I enjoyed about the old cartoon; it was so inconsistent that the robots could basically do anything). And besides this the Transformers are powerful enough to be a threat to Man; they can't be harmed by just any missiles or artillery shells (in the cartoon Starscream, Skywarp and Thundercracker were driven away by just regular AA missiles from an F-15 and in the US comic the Autobots were injured by a barrage from a few ordinary tanks). Mankind can't possibly handle the Decepticons without the Autobots' help.

9. The whole setup is a huge, epic interplanetary battle over the fate of the universe between good and evil. The Decepticons have decimated or destroyed countless alien worlds and many alien civilizations and are feared throughout the universe. They're not just some stereotypical Saturday Morning Cartoon Villains who think up lame plots. Megatron is actually a very cunning, powerful, fearsome villain.

10. The actual plot is about the same as the old US cartoon; Unicron is just a big robot, not a god, and there is no Primus.

11. Cybertron is not mis-sized (in the old cartoon when it was entering Earth's orbit it didn't look nearly as big as a planet or even a small moon).

12. It's based in the 1980's. It has to be. You all damned well know it.

13. There's no political correctness in this cartoon.

14. The reason that alien fish-monkey thing (I'm not quite sure on his name so we'll call him AFMT for short, which stands for "Alien Fish Monkey Thing") built Unicron so he could get revenge on the Transformers. The reason why AFMT wants to kill them all is because he's lived for millions of years and can't stand living anymore and wants to die. But he's immmortal and indestructible. However, AFMT used his superhuman intellect to build a machine that can kill him, but the machine can't be replaced, rebuilt, repaired or duplicated if it's destroyed. A fierce battle between the Autobots and Decepticons breaks out in AFMT's lab (they were fighting over the machine) and the machine is destroyed in said battle. Thusly, Mr. AFMT blames all Transformers for cursing him with immortality and builds Unicron to get revenge. Also, Unicron's power is well-defined. There's no idea that he's Galactus or that he can't be stopped by anything but the Matrix, but Unicron doesn't get new A-holes torn in him by the Dinobots or get hurt by starships flying into his eye or Autobots driving through it. Plus, Unicron is maybe bigger. For example, there's a scene where Trypticon flies right up to Unicron's detached head and Trypticon's only a tiny little dot or speck compared to it. IMO, that would make Unicron as big as a planet.

15. The writing's actually really good, and none of the writers are fellows who have ever gone by the name of Simon Furman or Bob Budiansky.

16. It's in cell animation (normal animation, for some reason I forget what it's called), not computer crap, and it doesn't look like cell animation done by computer crap, unlike Transformers: Armada or Transformers: Cybertron.

17. When Optimus Prime dies it's actually by self-sacrifice instead of just getting killed. Don't tell me the Dinobots couldn't have beaten Megatron.

18. Rodimus Prime is actually a heroic, manly, powerful, intelligent, decisive leader who's fit to handle Optimus's job instead of some bunghole. His robot mode (both as Hot Rod and Rodimus) looks better but he still turns into that cool sports car truck thingy.

19. Sky Lynx doesn't look like a turkey.

20. In the event that a toy line comes out for this the toys actually look like the characters on the show and are well-designed. Megatron doesn't look like he has part of a pistol for a dick with a trigger for his nuts.

21. Some of the characters' alternate modes are more modern. For example, Star Scream is an F-22, Skywarp and Thundercrackers are SU-35's (or 37's, I forget...well it's the one that looks a lot like an SU-27 but with a different number), etc. Sideswipe and Sunstreaker Transform into Lamborghini Gallardo's. Hound transforms into a hummer. Megatron transforms into a much newer gun than an old Walther P-38. However, some of the Transformers still have the same alt modes as before, EG Optimus is still a big ol' truck and Bumblebee is still an old 60's VW beetle instead of the crappy new VW bug. Soundwave is still a casette player (because I can't think of anything else the Casetticons can transform into).

22. Basically, everything Furman ever did has nothing to do with this cartoon whatsoever.

[Denyer]

1. The Transformers would be in-character. Optimus Prime wouldn't have any problem killing

Unfortunately, Prime being reluctant to kill is his character.

15. The writing's actually really good, and none of the writers are fellows who have ever gone by the name of Simon Furman or Bob Budiansky.

You must have missed that part where Budiansky and Shooter wrote all of the profiles and background material the cartoon hacks subsequently based episodes off.

It's based in the 1980's. It has to be.

It wouldn't be Transformers without hideous mullets.

There's no political correctness in this cartoon.

Certainly isn't. Wouldn't want, say, the naming of a country as Carbombya to cause one of your voice acting stars to walk out on the production...

Total creative control? I'd reverse the lobotomies of television watchers and teach them to read.

[spiderfrommars]

The writing's actually really good, and none of the writers are fellows who have ever gone by the name of Simon Furman or Bob Budiansky.

Interesting how you're happy to drone on and on how much better the writing in the cartoon is over the comic and yet so many of the points you've raised actually appeared in the comic already and not the show.

Megatron wouldn't inexplicably let a fleshling go

There's some character development and a certain number of characters are focused on but there's still a cast of hundreds.

Every time the Autobots and Decepticons do battle there are for some reason a whole bunch of random robot extras on each side who get killed so that we know the battle is actually dangerous

the Transformers are powerful enough to be a threat to Man; they can't be harmed by just any missiles or artillery shells

The whole setup is a huge, epic interplanetary battle over the fate of the universe between good and evil.

The Decepticons have decimated or destroyed countless alien worlds and many alien civilizations and are feared throughout the universe.

They're not just some stereotypical Saturday Morning Cartoon Villains who think up lame plots.

Megatron is actually a very cunning, powerful, fearsome villain.

Cybertron is not mis-sized

See?

female Autobots (what's the point? Why do they need female robots if Transformers can't sexually reproduce?

FINALLY you've said something I agree with.

[Metal Vendetta]

The writing's actually really good, and none of the writers are fellows who have ever gone by the name of Simon Furman or Bob Budiansky.

Interesting how you're happy to drone on and on how much better the writing in the cartoon is over the comic and yet so many of the points you've raised actually appeared in the comic already and not the show.

Also:

Optimus Prime wouldn't have any problem killing.

Like when he came back in US#80 and trashed all the Decepticons, then? Or when he went up against Tantrum in G2? Comic Prime fought - and killed - when he had to.

The human characters have names that actually make sense, not "Spike" or "Sparkplug".

Names like Buster Witwicky, GB Blackrock, Josie Beller etc?

Basically, the cast of "main" robots (ones with personalities, histories and backgrounds) is not as limited; it includes every character that was shown in the US cartoon and US comic book, and every character who had his own toy.

UK comic again, I think. Only missing a couple from the cartoon and some of the later toys.

Some characters aren't there, such as Wheelie and the female Autobots

Well Arcee exists, but there is a valid reason for it. Wheelie also appears, but only briefly in the future stories. No female Autobots in the comics.

Mankind can't possibly handle the Decepticons without the Autobots' help.

See G2.

It's based in the 1980's. It has to be. You all damned well know it.

The UK comic was written in the 80s. Has that extra "authentic" feel.

When Optimus Prime dies it's actually by self-sacrifice instead of just getting killed.

See at least two of Prime's comic deaths. The one with the computer game wasn't quite as good, but we'll gloss over that.

Rodimus Prime is actually a heroic, manly, powerful, intelligent, decisive leader who's fit to handle Optimus's job instead of some bunghole.

Like UK comics Rodimus maybe?

...Star Scream is an F-22...

Like he is in the new IDW comic...which Furman wrote and updated the alt-modes on?

Basically, everything Furman ever did has nothing to do with this cartoon whatsoever.

So contradicting the point above then.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

So essentially make it like everyone else has pointed out clearly how the Comics were orginaly written and made.

[inflatable dalek]

21. Some of the characters' alternate modes are more modern.

But you want it still set in the 80's...

However, I'm all in favour of the new name for Monkey boy.

[Stormwolf]

10. The actual plot is about the same as the old US cartoon

The US cartoon had a plot?

[E.J.Su]

12. It's based in the 1980's. It has to be. You all damned well know it.

21. Some of the characters' alternate modes are more modern. For example, Star Scream is an F-22, Skywarp and Thundercrackers are SU-35's (or 37's, I forget...well it's the one that looks a lot like an SU-27 but with a different number), etc. Sideswipe and Sunstreaker Transform into Lamborghini Gallardo's. Hound transforms into a hummer.

F-22 didn't go into mass production untill mid 90's, Gallardo initial development started in year 2000. Technically Hummer was mass produced in the mid 80's, but those aren't really much of a disguise untill the civilian version in the 90's. but I gotta agree with VW though.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

the F-22 is in productiuon, I still thought it was in testing?

[E.J.Su]

oops, I meant approved for production in '95.

[BB Shockwave]

New G1 cartoon?

I already did a topic about this: I'd redo the Marvel US/UK comic with small changes (leaving out stuff like the Mechanic and Shooting star, replacing one-issue human reporters/scientists with the likes of Joy Meadows and Susan Hoffmann) and smoothing down the few continuity error edges (better explanation for the two Megs case, for example).

If it worked with TMNT and Justice League, why not TFs?

[Bouncelot]

New G1 cartoon?

I already did a topic about this: I'd redo the Marvel US/UK comic with small changes (leaving out stuff like the Mechanic and Shooting star, replacing one-issue human reporters/scientists with the likes of Joy Meadows and Susan Hoffmann) and smoothing down the few continuity error edges (better explanation for the two Megs case, for example).

If it worked with TMNT and Justice League, why not TFs?

You know, before you posted that, I'd personally wondered about doing a "remastered" version of the comic, removing plot and continuity holes, redoing the worst bits of artwork (Yomtov, for example), bunging some of the annual stories into the run, reordering them to make a bit more sense and make sure each issue had at least 11 pages of TF strip with no reprints. The cartoon idea gives you more flexibility to muck around with things, though.

[BB Shockwave]

I'm still thinking about writing the ideas of the 'TF Marvel cartoon' down for future's sake... even if no-one outside this board would give a damn about it. I've re-thought most of the issues/episodes and even found a way to shoehorn Earthforce without distrupting continuty...

Guess I'm just too lazy to write it down. Even now I should be translating 'Enemy Within' 2 to hungarian for my new site...

[Bouncelot]

I'm still thinking about writing the ideas of the 'TF Marvel cartoon' down for future's sake... even if no-one outside this board would give a damn about it. I've re-thought most of the issues/episodes and even found a way to shoehorn Earthforce without distrupting continuty...

How, how, how? *bounces around eagerly awaiting an answer*

I've currently got Earthforce down as a divergent universe myself.

[BB Shockwave]

Will PM you since we're getting off topic (plus, there's the matter of copyright )

[ShadowSonic]

Eh, for the human characters I think you should just make up an entirely new char like Batman: TAS did with Summer Gleeson, and just put them in for the resporters/scientists. I don't see the appeal of chars like Joy Meadows over any of Bob's human chars. I read "Girls' night out" and I still don't see what was so much better about them.

Agree on the art. I mean, I doubt people would like Furmans' stuff as much if it was all drawn by the guys who were doing Bob' stories. Just like how I'm sure people would think better of Bob's stuff if Geoff Senior drew them. Imagine the two-page spread of all the dead Autobots in US # 5 if Geoff drew them.

I think the new TMNT is the ebtter example of translating comics to TV, all the DC cartoons made rather big changes to some things in the villains and heroes and stuff.

[spiderfrommars]

I don't see the appeal of chars like Joy Meadows over any of Bob's human chars.

You don't see her appeal over any Bob characters? You'd rather have 'O'? The Roadjammers? The Mechanic?

She's more well rounded and likeable than most of them with the possible exception of Blackrock or Finkleberg.

In The National Interest is an example of a human-centric story done right. Feel free to take Rock and Roll Out instead if you like.

I read "Girls' night out" and I still don't see what was so much better about them.

It's called Ladies Night and hardly the finest hour of the 3 human characters involved.

I mean, I doubt people would like Furmans' stuff as much if it was all drawn by the guys who were doing Bob' stories.

Rubbish. Plenty of Furman's UK stuff was poorly illustrated but is still acclaimed.

Just like how I'm sure people would think better of Bob's stuff if Geoff Senior drew them. Imagine the two-page spread of all the dead Autobots in US # 5 if Geoff drew them.

Er, New Order is a fan favourite despite the art.

Stop making excuses.

[ShadowSonic]

I dunno, I wouldn't have liked Time Wars as much if it was done by the same guys who were doing the US comics (Yomtov, was that his name). Same for "Matrix Quest", but then again I never liked that story...

Same for Target 2006, but then again, I stopped liking that as much after I realized that the story's impact was somewhat lessened after the release of the movie and the plot holes started to add up...

Anyways, I haven't read "National Interest", can't find it anywhere.

"O" wasn't a Bob char, was he? I thought he was a holdover from Ralph Macchio.

I still think just inventing new human chars from scratch and putting them in is a more logical thing. I mean, Snapper Carr in Justice League was based off of an existing comic char, and they ditched him after season 1. Summer Gleeson was an original char and she gets more respect.

[spiderfrommars]

I dunno, I wouldn't have liked Time Wars as much if it was done by the same guys who were doing the US comics

A major selling point for Time Wars is some of the art yes, but the scipt has plenty of faults anyway.

Same for "Matrix Quest", but then again I never liked that story...

Some of the Matrix Quest art was pants tho.

Anyways, I haven't read "National Interest", can't find it anywhere.

Maybe you shouldn't be laying into Meadows' character if you haven't read all her stories then?

She's hardly an exceptional character anyway, but is solid enough. Her appearance in Ladies Night is gratuitous and not a fair example to judge her by.

You can get In the National Interest in the Dinobot Hunt TPB.

"O" wasn't a Bob char, was he? I thought he was a holdover from Ralph Macchio.

Bob was editor and must share the blame!

[Impactor returns 2.0]

I like Joy Medows, surely the 'orignal' April O'neil ?

[Legion]

I mean, I doubt people would like Furmans' stuff as much if it was all drawn by the guys who were doing Bob' stories. Just like how I'm sure people would think better of Bob's stuff if Geoff Senior drew them. Imagine the two-page spread of all the dead Autobots in US # 5 if Geoff drew them.

Yes, many of Bob's stories get a (unfair) bad wrap because of the art and it appears (from the reaction of the people who liked DW's stuff anyway) that there is a large portion of people that would rather look at nice art than read good stories... unfortunately. So good stories that happen to have bad art are automatically written off by lots of people which is a shame as the whole "Shockers has Prime's head on a pole" arc is great and is one of my fave arcs in the entire comic.

I read "Girls' night out" and I still don't see what was so much better about them.

Whilst not the best story (it was pretty much a filler in the Galvy/Magnus arc afterall), it did have Joy Meadows in a pericularly short miniskirt (Geoff Senior stylee ).

[ShadowSonic]

Sorry dude, the only time I ever think a comic lady is hot is if they're drawn by Alex Ross, and even then it's rare

April O'Neil was only a reporter in the TMNT cartoon, in the original comics (which came out either before TFs or at the same time) she was a scientist.

[Best First]

Sorry dude, the only time I ever think a comic lady is hot is if they're drawn by Alex Ross, and even then it's rare

Psylocke. Jim Lee.

[ShadowSonic]

Meh, Jim Lee women are okay but the whole "all Jim Lee women must be swimsuit models" thing sorta dilutes the hotness after a while. I mean, making Rogue a sexbomb was sorta wierd, considering her power and it's affect on her personality...

[Impactor returns 2.0]

Greg Horn - Emma Frost.

http://www.greghornjudge.com/emma_frost ... Thumbnails

nuff said...

psy-lock

[ShadowSonic]

Eh, those are alright. I'll take Claudia Schiffer anyday though if you don't mind

Anyways, rather odd how a discussion over a new TF cartoon based on the comics has become a topic over hottie comic chicks...

[Denyer]

I think we're waiting for the original thread poster to finish gulping down Brandon Lee's ashes.

Greg Horn - Emma Frost.

http://www.greghornjudge.com/emma_frost_3_xmen.htm

Emma as modelled by Pam Anderson? #6 nails the photo-imagery quite well though, and #10 has a neat concept.

[Legion]

something that's always made me wonder is, when these (admittedly fictional) people discover they have mutant/special powers whatnot, the immidiately start to dress in quite revealing leather/spandex whatever...

(not that i'm complaining btw)

[Bouncelot]

something that's always made me wonder is, when these (admittedly fictional) people discover they have mutant/special powers whatnot, the immidiately start to dress in quite revealing leather/spandex whatever...

ISTR that Furman made a joke about it in The Human Factor. At least Thuinderpunch and Rapture were uncomfortable with the idea.

[ShadowSonic]

Yeah, Thunderpunch said he felt more like a dancer in Swan Lake, and also said that even Rapture's tight costume couldn't make her look hot.

One of the only fems in comics I know who complain about their revealing costumes was Silk Spectre in "Watchmen". EVeryone (including herself) was complaining about how she was running around in her underwear or something. Well, except Nite Owl...