March TF Comic Sales

[Yaya]

Here we go for March:

74 TRANSFORMERS INFILTRATION #3 Estimated 30,000 copies
89 GI JOE VS TRANSFORMERS VOL 3 ART O/WAR #1 (Of 5)* Estimated 25,800 copies
94 TRANSFORMERS BEAST WARS (IDW) #2 (Of 4) Estimated 24,900 copies

Infiltration dropped about (gulp) 20 places from #2. We're not oozing here folks, we're hemorraging.

Beast Wars #2 dropped almost 40 (!) spots. Ouch.


http://www.newsarama.com/marketreport/mar06sales.html

[spiderfrommars]

I expect G1 to level out and stay in the Top 100.

[Yaya]

I hope you're right in this.

These 20 point drops are hair raising, to say the least.

And given the positive feedback on this series in nearly every message board, it just doesn't make sense to me why these precipitous drops are occuring in the first place.

[Shanti418]

There are probably some fair weather, "just hurry up and give me some robots fighting" fans that have lost their patience.

[Professor Smooth]

Unless I'm mistaken, these numbers do not represent the number of books sold to readers. The numbers represent how many copies were ordered by comic book stores.

[Denyer]

And not re-orders below a certain threshold, or sales to stores supplied by Diamond UK (inc. chunks of Europe.)

Basically, by #3 most people who were getting multiple covers have stopped doing so, stores automatically lower orders and work on a re-order basis, etc.

Look at the patterns on other start-up titles, especially those not by DC/Marvel.

[KingMob]

And not re-orders below a certain threshold, or sales to stores supplied by Diamond UK (inc. chunks of Europe.)

Basically, by #3 most people who were getting multiple covers have stopped doing so, stores automatically lower orders and work on a re-order basis, etc.

Look at the patterns on other start-up titles, especially those not by DC/Marvel.

Exactly. 24K sales at the halfway point of a mini published by one of the tinier companies is great.

Seeing as you like the figure analysis stuff YaYa, if you don't already, I'd recommend you read Paul O'Brien's monthy analysis of the Marvel figures and the similar analysis of the DC figures by The Other Guy; you can find the old ones on google groups or some of the comic boards. These include calculable re-order sales which are normally several thousand copies. Also, CBG has a great archive of previous figures, going back years. They aid in following the market trends, which are normally rather predictable after a while, and the commentary made by the peeps going over the figs can be quite interesting/funny.

Mini's appear to normally lose half of their sales figures over their run. Series books (normally) take continual sales losses until an artifical spike is introduced - which can come in many forms - and after which the pattern resumes. There's no predictable set drop, although the drop between 1 and 2 is almost always the largest unless the book is not supported by the publisher and goes into freefall. 20% or more drops are not uncommon, and you regularly see books like the X-Men titles lose 8 or 9 percent every month. A "stable" book drops about 4% every month and a "rock solid" book loses 1-2%. The percentage drop is more helpful than straight numerical placing.
In this case, I am guessing that Stormbringer is intended to cause a spike in the sales for the G1 market.

Regardless TF is turning in great sales figs for IDW and I don't think there's any reason for any punters to be worrying over it. The nostalgia boom is over so stratospheric sales figs like DW started with are simply not going to happen. TF is a niche-market book put out by a small, highly competent company and the figs have to be looked at with that in mind IMHO.
IDW know what they're about; they've even bumped off Rich Johnston:
http://www.idwpublishing.com/dyinggut.shtml

Sorry for rambling.

[spiderfrommars]

Damn fine post KM.

Lets be realistic here people.

[Yaya]

Regardless TF is turning in great sales figs for IDW and I don't think there's any reason for any punters to be worrying over it. The nostalgia boom is over so stratospheric sales figs like DW started with are simply not going to happen. TF is a niche-market book put out by a small, highly competent company and the figs have to be looked at with that in mind IMHO.
.

Looking at the sales figures alone, you're right, it's quite good, especially by a small independent publisher like IDW.

My worry is the cost of the TF license, and do these sales figures justify having a TF comic. This is not CSI or the more obscure licenses that IDW holds. The Transformers property is quite expensive relative to their other products, I would think.

The ends have to justify the means. It's a good showing by Diamond rankings, but in house, will this performance cover the overhead?

I just hope that they sell enough comics to make their acquistion of the TF license a good business move. I don't know what Hasbro has charged IDW for the license, but I pray its something quite managable by IDW. IDW won't go out of business from this by any means. But they certainly might dump the license if they end up in the red.

[Denyer]

This is not CSI or the more obscure licenses that IDW holds.

CSI is far bigger than Transformers is. So is 24. Just because I rarely watch TV doesn't mean I'm oblivious to schedules or what's getting glossy magazine spreads...

Hasbro may well have an over-inflated idea of what the Transformers brand is worth... although for Star Wars, a huge licensed toy concern for Hasbro, comic sales aren't stellar. On a closer note we know that Devil's Due was another bidder for the TF comics license, already holds the G.I. Joe brand for comics and what their issue sales on G.I. Joe are.

[Scraplet]

My worry is the cost of the TF license, and do these sales figures justify having a TF comic.

At the end of the day, Hasbro need someone to keep a TF title running just to keep us, the regulars, interested. They are astute (sp?)business people, and if we loose interest, they're f*****.

So, I'm sure the licence will always reflect the market value. Its a marketing tool. They make their money out of the toys. The 400k DW were paying is naff all in the grand scheme of things. How much do TV adverts cost......?

[KingMob]

This is not CSI or the more obscure licenses that IDW holds.

CSI is far bigger than Transformers is. So is 24.
Hasbro may well have an over-inflated idea of what the Transformers brand is worth... although for Star Wars, a huge licensed toy concern for Hasbro, comic sales aren't stellar. On a closer note we know that Devil's Due was another bidder for the TF comics license, already holds the G.I. Joe brand for comics and what their issue sales on G.I. Joe are.

IDW have also ecently picked up the rights to do Star Trek comics; handling licence fees doesn't seem too great a problem for them considering how long they've been publishing licenced books now. TF is one of the better performing licences, in serial form at any rate, and is now in the hands of proven company. I mean, if we're going onto talking overheads, IDW have got bank.
I'm not seeing any cause for monthly freak-outs by the punters, not yet anyway. That way lies ulcers. Let's see what happens after the end of Infiltration. If there's a nasty drop between Inf #6 and Stormbringer, then I'd be concerned. Despite the overseas screw-up, the figures for BW are also going to be more useful next month, as the drop between 3 and 4 should be more indicative of how loyal a readership retailers think exists. You can't really put a huge deal of weight on a mini's sales tho, unless it opens with figures in the mid-teens, I suppose. And even then it could be a hit in TPB.

Personally, I'm digging more books from IDW at the mo' than I ever have before; I'm really enjoying SUPERMARKET in particular at the moment. Only on #2, worth checking out.

[Yaya]

This is not CSI or the more obscure licenses that IDW holds.

CSI is far bigger than Transformers is. So is 24. Just because I rarely watch TV doesn't mean I'm oblivious to schedules or what's getting glossy magazine spreads...

Hasbro may well have an over-inflated idea of what the Transformers brand is worth... although for Star Wars, a huge licensed toy concern for Hasbro, comic sales aren't stellar. On a closer note we know that Devil's Due was another bidder for the TF comics license, already holds the G.I. Joe brand for comics and what their issue sales on G.I. Joe are.

Good points. And encouraging ones as well.

However, its unlikely that CSI or 24 will be around after two decades. Transformers has proven its staying power throughout all these years, so I would venture that Hasbro puts more value on its Transformers property than whoever own CSI or 24 values these properties.

They are astute (sp?)business people, and if we loose interest, they're f*****.

Not really. In the world of business, its the bottom line that matters most. TF comics don't provide a fraction of the revenue the toys or this movie is going too. Also, Hasbro is more than just TF. They hold so many properties, 40,000 comic book readers are a drop in the bucket for them.

More than likely, they view the comic book as nothing more than an avenue for advertisement for the toy.

I mean, if we're going onto talking overheads, IDW have got bank.

I'm sure they do. And they know what constitutes a good business deal and what doesn't. I just hope TF continues to be profitable for them. Obviously, we can only speculate because we don't have any clue what their overhead or profit is from this comic.

I think after three separate TF comic cancellations, fans like myself tend to be a little paranoid.

[Yaya]

Now here's some encouraging news:

104 TRANSFORMERS GENERATIONS (IDW) #1* Estimated 23,700 copies


Wow. That's awesome for reprints.

[Denyer]

I think after three separate TF comic cancellations

Dreamwave titles weren't cancelled, and G2 was only ever solicited as twelve issues.

I'd guess the rights arrangements aren't too different to those for G.I. Joe -- which has also been around (in the modern Cobra/Joes form) since the 80s, and is a fairly strong-selling Hasbro owned brand.

[KingMob]

Apparently, BW #2 has been a complete sell-out at Diamond:

http://www.seibertron.com/news/view.php?id=7110

"It's great to see quality books met with such positive performance," said IDW's Publisher and Editor-in-Chief Chris Ryall. "We print significantly more copies than the initial orders we receive from Diamond. When we set a print run for a book, we try to print enough copies so that retailers will be able to re-order the books through the run of the series. These sell-outs caught us by a surprise, and signal a nice upturn for the industry in general. I also hope these numerous sell-outs encourage retailers to similarly recognize the demand for IDW's books and order accordingly. As much as I love to see a title sell out, I like even more for anyone who wants an IDW comic to be able to easily find it."

along with a few other titles.
Seeing an increase in sell-outs on a lot of titles these days...

[Yaya]

Here we go, official March numbers:

74 TRANSFORMERS INFILTRATION #3 30,344 copies
89 GI JOE VS TRANSFORMERS VOL 3 ART O/WAR #1 26,561 copies
94 TRANSFORMERS BEAST WARS (IDW) #2 25,737 copies
104 TRANSFORMERS GENERATIONS (IDW) #1* 24,104 copies

http://www.icv2.com/articles/news/8516.html

[Yaya]

From Prime Directive through the ongoing:

ISSUE#
Prime Directive
1. 119,251 copies
2. 115,653 copies
3. 131,586 copies
4. 126,124 copies
5. 122,829 copies
6. 119,533 copies
War and Peace
1. 111,355 copies
2. 74,322 copies
3. 67,211 copies
4. 64,886 copies
5. 61,587 copies
6. 62,947 copies
G1 Ongoing
0. 53,081 copies
1. 57,537 copies
2. 44,714 copies
3. 41,194 copies
4. 43,083 copies
5. 37,710 copies
6. 36,211 copies
7. 34,756 copies
8. 31,942 copies
9. 31,272 copies
10. 29,682 copies

War Within Vol. 1.
1. 99,522 copies
2. 82,174 copies
3. 73,385 copies
4. 59,253 copies
5. 61,847 copies
6. 50,878 copies

War Within The Dark Ages
1. 62,548 copies
2. 43,253 copies
3. 39,958 copies
4. 34,347 copies
5. 32,448 copies
6. 31,109 copies

War Within Age of Wrath
1. 33,502 copies
2. 23,943 copies
3. 22,928 copies

More Than Meet the Eye Profile Books
1. 20,519 copies
2. 19,467 copies
3. 19,063 copies
4. 23,368 copies
5. 24,219 copies
6. 24,253 copies

Micromasters
1. 29,743 copies
2. 26,052 copies
3. 24,199 copies
4. 22,517 copies

Summer Special May 2004
27,109 copies

Armada More Than Meets the Eye
1. 18,925 copies
2. 17,470 copies
3. 16,907 copies

Poster Book
6,454 copies

For comparison, IDW figures:

Infiltration:
1. 45,468 copies
2. 35,828 copies
3. 30,344 copies

Beast Wars:
1. 34,047 copies
2. 25,737 copies

Generations:
1. 24,104 copies

[Denyer]

Probably should've waited for the rest.

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showpost. ... stcount=97

Volume 2 #1 --> 3 was the biggest stumbling block, it appears. If DW were sitting on printed but unsold stock, that's where it would've happened. Although the decline of Armada/Energon from 136K to 17K is... wow.

[Predabot]

Damn... War Within just kept falling and falling and falling...

It would appear as if the thing that sold overall the most stable, was the Profile-books. Huh, waddayaknow... never would have figured a profile-book to be popular enough to actually sell better and better.

[spiderfrommars]

Although the decline of Armada/Energon from 136K to 17K is... wow.

The better the story, the less it sold.

Funny old world.

War Within just kept falling and falling and falling...

And G1 didn't?

[Predabot]

And G1 didn't?

Well yeah, but as you would logically agree, it was much less justified.

[KingMob]

And G1 didn't?

Well yeah, but as you would logically agree, it was much less justified.

Dunno about that. The ongoing and the minis seem to have pretty natural declines. Successful mini's normally post sales a position a bit lower than their parent and then halve. The only change between minis - other than the TF brand becoming less and less of a market force in total - was the swap-out of artists, and with respect to all concerned, the marquee value of their names also consistently dropped. The sales pattern of all 3 - other than the curtailment of AoW, is really quite similar - issue #1 outsells issue #5 of previous for example - just starting from a lower point.
Which I believe is fairly natural considering when those titles launched.
G1 actually seemed to be finding it's level towards the end. Huh.

Profile books went up because of adjustment once retailers figured they'd guessed wrong. Profile books aren't seen as big sellers but as we all know MTMTE was considered very hot by the fandom, so later orders were adjusted accordingly.

Read an anecdote that indicates that the UK was due at least 3,000 copies of BW#3 that didn't show. So that may be of some interest when you consider the amounts of UK sales that don't show up on these charts.

[Denyer]

Read an anecdote that indicates that the UK was due at least 3,000 copies of BW#3 that didn't show.

Yeah, Diamond said something like that to Steve Bax when he phoned... about 200 copies made it to the UK of 3000+ (which didn't even seem to include sales Diamond UK then makes to other European countries.)

They also seemed to be trying to pass the buck. Dunno, I trust the publisher far more than the distributor.

[Yaya]

G1 actually seemed to be finding it's level towards the end. Huh.

How bout that. But DW naysayers insist it was the quality of the product only. Nothing more.