Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen

jengla · Post by **jengla** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:06 pm

Hey all,

I am a Transformers nut from old. I subscribed to all of the UK comics of Transformers (until my bloody mother burned them).

I have a question about the upcoming Transformers sequel.

It has recently been "confirmed" Michael Bay is referring to a species (or range) of robots called "The Fallen" and not to Megatron from the first film.

Is it just me, or am I the only person in the world who has never heard of this group? I know that there are differences between the UK and USA comics, but I am not convinced. Bay has already suggested he is likely to leak false information and this just sounds like a MASSIVE lie.

Could someone (with a better memory) enlighten me

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:42 pm

Hi. Welcome to the jungle.

The Fallen never appeared in the old Marvel comics off of the 80s. Instead, twas a creation for Dreamwave's comic series a few years back.

It's a specific robot rather than a group or species. The only appearance to date was in a mini series called "War Within - The Dark Ages" (the second War Within mini, WWI being Dreamwave's "prequel" series to complement their main story), written by Simon Furman and drawn by Andy Wildman (both of whom worked on the original Marvel run).

I'm unsure of the accuracy regarding the character being in the film, but the title has been widely and officially confirmed as Revenge of the Fallen. I know Bay stated there'd be misinformation, but there's leaking false rumours, and then there's being a bastard. I doubt they'd go to lengths such as those.

More info on the character of The Fallen can be found here:
http://transformers.wikia.com/wiki/The_Fallen

His appearance would probably tie in thematically with the whole 25th anniversary push and the "The Thirteen" origin comic that's coming.

jengla · Post by **jengla** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:42 pm

Hey thanks for the info. Thought I was not remembering a key moment in Transformers history for a second.

If the title does actually refer to the robot you mentioned instead of Megatron, I'd be very surprised. It just doesn't sound very commercial to use this (not as well known) character.

I also wouldn't put it past Mr Bay. I'm sure he'd get a kick out of winding the fanboys up (not that I am one of course).

Rodimus Prime · Post by **Rodimus Prime** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:46 am

Michael Bay was the worst thing to happen to the TF franchise since Wheelie. I wish that a "real fan" of the series would have taken the helm of director.

It worked for:
Spiderman
Superman Returns
X-men
Iron-Man

I like some Michael Bay movies...

call me nostalgic but I prefer the original movie to the live action one

sidestreaker · Post by **sidestreaker** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 7:23 am

call me nostalgic but I prefer the original movie to the live action one

Don't we all

Bayformers has no soul. It's a empty shell in a shiny suit.

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 7:48 am

sidestreaker wrote:
call me nostalgic but I prefer the original movie to the live action one
Don't we all

No.

Professor Smooth · Post by **Professor Smooth** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:05 am

Follow me for a second here:

There are, by most estimates, about 10,000 loyal Transformers fans out there. By that I mean the "collect, keep up with the news, read the comics, own the DVDs" type fans.

A movie ticket costs about 9 dollars.

Therefore, the so called "real fans" made up about 90,000 dollars. Assuming they all saw it twice, you're looking at 180,000 dollars.

Worldwide, Transformers made 708,000,000 dollars in theaters alone.

What obligation should Michael Bay have to such a small fraction of the audience?

Optimus Prime was a truck (voiced by Peter Cullen), Bumblebee was yellow, Megatron was evil and stuff transformed. That's fine.

The same goes for Spider-Man. Spider-Man's monthly readership hovers around 200,000. If every single one of those readers didn't go see the first movie, it would have eaten up around 1% of its business.

I'm not saying that the TF movie wasn't crap, mind you. I'm just saying that, from a business standpoint, what they did was fine.

Ozz · Post by **Ozz** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:06 am

Brendocon wrote:No.

Same here.

Also, there is no such thing as real fans. There are only fans.

Hot Shot · Post by **Hot Shot** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:45 am

Rodimus Prime wrote:Michael Bay was the worst thing to happen to the TF franchise since Wheelie. I wish that a "real fan" of the series would have taken the helm of director.

Agreed.

Ozz wrote:Also, there is no such thing as real fans. There are only fans

Not true. Bay says he's a fan, but he only likes his version. I don't like Yu-Gi-Oh, but if I replaced the monsters with robots, the cards with cds, and took away the stupid hair styles to make my own version, it wouldn't make me a Yu-Gi-Oh fan, would it?

Post by **Best First** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:42 pm

everyone only likes their own version. I would have thought that is obvious.

He might not be your kind of fan but in and of itself that does not make him any more or less of a fan of something than you are.

Trying to create the distinction is just childish.

Personally in terms of bad things happening to the TF franchise i would say Pat Lee and the recent IDW editorial decisions have p*ssed me off more than last years movie did.

Rodimus Prime · Post by **Rodimus Prime** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:08 pm

Hey I have no problem with making $$$...
And Im sure there were issues on this website that were beaten to death, but come on!!!

You could have probably taken almost any director (except the Wachowskis - my god they have gone Lucas :senile: ) , and with the right promo the movie still would have made big $$$.

I remember reading about the changes that were made to Spiderman and I was really pissed, after seeing the movie - it worked!!

Same thing with X-men, Iron Man, Dark Knight, and even the New Hulk

The fact is that most guys ages 36-25 are probably some kind of TF fan. The movie didnt have to be geared only at hardcore fans, Peter Jackson did a fantastic job of keeping almost everyone happy

Ozz · Post by **Ozz** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 4:16 pm

Hot Shot wrote:Not true. Bay says he's a fan, but he only likes his version. I don't like Yu-Gi-Oh, but if I replaced the monsters with robots, the cards with cds, and took away the stupid hair styles to make my own version, it wouldn't make me a Yu-Gi-Oh fan, would it?

I neither know or care about Yu-Gi-Oh, but if this new thing still would be called that... Actually, sod it. It doesn't have anything to do with what Bay did, cause that movie was Transformers and anyone who liked it is no less of a fan than anyone who likes that cartoon from the 80s.

Hot Shot · Post by **Hot Shot** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 6:05 pm

Ozz wrote: It doesn't have anything to do with what Bay did, cause that movie was Transformers and anyone who liked it is no less of a fan than anyone who likes that cartoon from the 80s.

I never said anything about the movie fans, just Bay. Movie fans are Transformers fans, even if I don't agree with them.

Bay, on the other hand, made it clear he didn't like other Transformers media, and has only expressed that he's a fan of his own version. To me, it doesn't make any sense to say you're a fan of something only after you've made your own heavy "official" mods to it and rejected all other versions.

One analogy is: You can't stand doughnuts, so you create your own unique flavor of doughnut, fine-tuned to your own tastes. It wouldn't seem right(at least to me) to say you're a doughnut fan only after you changed it so you would like it.

Am I making any sense, or am I starting to ramble while making myself hungry?

sprunkner · Post by **sprunkner** » Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:41 am

Rodimus Prime wrote:Peter Jackson did a fantastic job of keeping almost everyone happy

Realistically, do you think anyone of Peter Jackson's caliber would be attracted to Transformers as a film property? There is a reason why Warren Ellis and Alan Moore have never written for the comics. It still sounds like a silly toy. It will take a while for TFs to get as iconic as the Fantastic Four or Superman, to the point where everyone takes them seriously.

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:11 pm

Rodimus Prime wrote:Michael Bay was the worst thing to happen to the TF franchise since Wheelie. I wish that a "real fan" of the series would have taken the helm of director.

It worked for:
Superman Returns

Except it didn't mate. Superman Returns is a quite boring and sometimes confusing movie... :\ And why, whyy, in the whole wide world, did he create Super-baby?? And of course the small feat that how come Superman is quite weakened by being so close to an entire island of Kryptonite at first, but is then able to root up the whole thing, even tho there are clearly K-crystals at the base as well as the top??

Another example is Daredevil... Mark Steven Johnson who both directed and co-wrote the movie is a big fan of the comic, that's why he took the job, but he still bloody failed. And I mean FAIL.

So, Rod mate, I think the prerequisite shouldn't be fandom, rather it should be artistic ability or whatnot, just being able to make good films.

I'm quite looking forward to the movie myself, and since the writers have said that they will go for more of a sci-fi vibe this time, and more characterization for the robots, I think this movie will actually be superior to the last one.

Obviously the fanboy within me is still pissed that we won't be seeing the Dinobots however...

Rodimus Prime · Post by **Rodimus Prime** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:19 am

Ahh Touche'

You make some really good points, I guess I just ahve a soft spot for Superman Returns because, well... he's one of my favs, but yeah I remember having the same issues you mentioned when I first saw it.

I try to forget that Daredevil was ever made.

Back to the TF movie...

I like some of Bays movies (The Rock/Armageddon/and yes even Pearl Harbor) but I really was hoping for "more" from this movie.

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 8:58 am

Yeah but if you look at films like Rock,Armageddon and Pearl Harbor, what did u expect from this guy? u were never going to get much beyond big explosions.

Post by **Best First** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 11:47 am

i think the thing that irks me most these days is just the designs. They are so bloody ugly. They look kind of cool wizzing about onscreen but staticly they ming and they are mostly devoid of character or expression.

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:09 pm

Especially megatron, its such a mess of plates and parts its hard to focus on him, thus its hard to define character and expression. - never understood his design concept at all. its like someone just drew a scribble and claimed it was a TF.

Metal Vendetta · Post by **Metal Vendetta** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:37 pm

I've heard the designs will be tweaked this time around to make them a bit more "Transformery". Would be nice if Megs found a bucket from somewhere.

Hot Shot · Post by **Hot Shot** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:25 pm

Metal Vendetta wrote:I've heard the designs will be tweaked this time around to make them a bit more "Transformery". Would be nice if Megs found a bucket from somewhere.

I'm sorry.

SPOILERS!

Highlight to read:

Corvette:Robot.
Megatron:Tank.Robot.
Long Haul:Both.

Oh, and Devastator is going to have ape proportions.

Post by **Best First** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:24 pm

Megatron's left arm is hilarious.

The car one would be ok if he just had a decent face.

Rodimus Prime · Post by **Rodimus Prime** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 3:03 am

And this time I want the damn transform sound!!!

sidestreaker · Post by **sidestreaker** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:48 am

Megatron looks so alien again, and his arms look stupid. He probably falls to the right everytime he transforms.

I like the devastator design. They should have called him Longhaul though, and all there heads look like alien predators.

Hot Shot · Post by **Hot Shot** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 3:53 pm

Dammit, new info says the corvette is Sideswipe.

TINO strikes again.

Ultrasabre · Post by **Ultrasabre** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:01 am

Hot Shot wrote:
Metal Vendetta wrote:I've heard the designs will be tweaked this time around to make them a bit more "Transformery". Would be nice if Megs found a bucket from somewhere.
I'm sorry.

SPOILERS!

Highlight to read:

Corvette:Robot.
Megatron:Tank.Robot.
Long Haul:Both.

Oh, and Devastator is going to have ape proportions.

LOL ya you better put the disclaimer before someone's world ends..

Very much lookin forward to this movie! I can't believe its coming out so soon!! WOOT! i heard they are doing with this what they did on LOTR is that true? That is make a few all at once... hope they do that!!

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:50 am

Predabot · Post by **Predabot** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 2:54 pm

He's excited about the muvie', Impster.

I say we let him have some joy in his life.

I'm probably a little bit excited as well, nowhere near the excitement from the first one tho, now I'm actually more intrigued if we're going to get a Masters of the Universe movie.

Oh, and the Ghostbusters 3 video-game of course.

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:44 pm

Couldnt see his text before so i thought it was just a quote!

Ultrasabre · Post by **Ultrasabre** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 10:39 am

********spoilers**************

Two transformers confirmed to make an appearance!

http://movies.ign.com/articles/913/913032p1.html

TransFans.co.uk

Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen

Thanks