Perhaps there is a God...

Post by **Kaylee** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:18 am

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7072404.stm

Just when everything looks bleakest, a bunch of loon-bucket ****-wits get precisely what they've had coming for a loong time...

Post by **Best First** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:38 pm

precisely what they have coming to them?

surely that would be them all getting buggered/strap on'd to death and then just before they died facing the awkward realisation they were quite enjoying it?

Brendocon · Post by **Brendocon** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:44 pm

I love fines.

"You shouldn't have done that."
"Here's some cash."
"On your way."

Post by **Kaylee** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:49 pm

Best First wrote:precisely what they have coming to them?

A fine large enough to bankrupt their organisation with any luck

Although your idea sounds more entertaining...

Shanti418 · Post by **Shanti418** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:29 pm

I'm not sure what to think about this at first glance.

On one hand, free speech yada yada yada. Plus religious expression, even if your religion is just a handful of people who founded a church whose singular trait is hating homosexuality and throwing parties when gay people die.

To this end though, I should have the same right to go up to a funeral where a Bible Thumping couple just buried their child due to a drunk driver and go, "Where's your God now?" But I don't think that would fly either. Still though, not going "Yay, you're dead and you deserved it!" will ALWAYS be socially unacceptable, although making it legally unacceptable would be a whole 'nother ball of wax.

But this new wrinkle with:

But they later extended their pickets to the funerals of soldiers, who they say are being punished by God because of America's tolerance of homosexuality.

is what they're being fined for, and that's assinine.

What the fine means is essentially, "You can celebrate the deaths of homosexuals all you want, just leave the troops out of it! Once you start going yay troops are dying, you suck."

Leatherneck · Post by **Leatherneck** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:12 am

I'm fairly certain this will be overturned at some level of appeal. Which I support. As f-ing absurd as these people are, and as much as I wish they were all slowly tortured to death, for us to revoke their right to freedom of expression would be a horrific thing for this country to do.

Perhaps some crazed lunatic will shoot all... 12? of them one day. Would be a worthwhile sacrifice.

BB Shockwave · Post by **BB Shockwave** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:20 am

Seriously, Europe has some crazy religions as well, but most of those are shams to make money and avoid taxes. The US is really full of these idiots and they even let them create churches...

I really should be getting about founding a Transformer religion. In Hungary you need only 100 members to legally start a church...

Post by **Kaylee** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:58 am

Now personally I don't see Freedom of Speech as an absolute- imo it most definitely has limits and those limits occur when the speech has crossed the line into harassment. You don't have freedom of speech to walk up to someone of African origin and call them an offensive word for example. There are accepted limits on Freedom of Speech.

In short people can be assholes all they want but the law has to protect other people from their assholery at some point.

imo anyway.

shanti wrote: What the fine means is essentially, "You can celebrate the deaths of homosexuals all you want, just leave the troops out of it! Once you start going yay troops are dying, you suck."

It's not great, but I suspect that's got more to do with the bloke who took them to court- he's sued them over ruining his sons funeral, not a larger case against their harassment of folk in general. Although that would have been nice, obviously.

wideload · Post by **wideload** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:14 pm

Karl Lynch wrote:Now personally I don't see Freedom of Speech as an absolute- imo it most definitely has limits and those limits occur when the speech has crossed the line into harassment. You don't have freedom of speech to walk up to someone of African origin and call them an offensive word for example. There are accepted limits on Freedom of Speech.

In short people can be assholes all they want but the law has to protect other people from their assholery at some point.

I agree. As soon as your speech starts to take away the rights of others, it should be limited. This includes hate speech and inciting violence towards others.

Aaron Hong · Post by **Aaron Hong** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 5:32 am

Karl Lynch wrote: A fine large enough to bankrupt their organisation with any luck

Assuming it's large enough, what's stopping them from lobbying for public donations to make up or it? Surely these loon-bucket ****-wits have a huge group of even bigger ****wits forming the 'general public' that backs their every word AND funds their movement, otherwise they wouldn't have reached this level in the first place?

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:48 am

freedom of speech my ass. These people are spewing hate, and distotrting views for thier own sick goals.

When they are pushed on the subject (see Louis T, BBC) they have no answer for what they are doing, and have no basis within the common terms of 'free speech'

Im glad they got fined, and I hope other states continue to ban, and impose large fines upon them for spouting such evil rhetoric.

Post by **Best First** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 11:44 am

i don't think you can dsipute that this restricts freedom of speech - freedome of speech is essentially he right to express any belief you want to.

what is more up to debate is how much of an unnassailable right that really is - i mean is anyone really going to say that the libel or slander laws are a bad thing? Because they certainly mean i can't say certain things without recrimination, but its reaosnable in that case i would say.

Impactor returns 2.0 · Post by **Impactor returns 2.0** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 12:37 pm

your right, anyone does have the right to say what they want.
And thats why we have slander laws at the same time to protect people from recrimination.

When I saw Louis go and visit this group, what I was more concerned about was the way they were brain-washing thier children. One of the girls involved was in university and was clearly troubled with what her family was doing.

And, even tho i dont care for religion much, it was really sad to see somthing being distorted into such a vessle of hate. almost scary.

Post by **Best First** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:58 pm

yeah, it was frrked up. The way she just started giggling when he challenged her.

and that guy who ran the whole thing, what a dropkick - "asked and answered, asked and answered". Crrrnt.