Nintendo Revolution

[Predabot]

Pick and Play for the DS is pretty correct, and also seems to be the way to go, as it seems to be working for the intended buyers.

I'd just like to pop in here and show you all a new article from gamespot. Basically it says the same things that we all ready know, but there's interesting things. Have a look.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05/26 ... 26595.html

[Impactor returns 2.0]

I think thats funny enough to sum up how ****** they are

[Predabot]

Whut, the article or somethin'? Quick answer by the way.

[Kaylee]

Wow that makes Breakfast with Frost look hard hitting...

"So, you guys have never put a foot wrong and always come out on top! How do you plan to use your obvious talents and greatness utterly thrash the competition once again?

Well I'm glad you asked that..."

The article has absolutely nothing hard to throw at Nintendo at all, even the fact they will be the last console to launch is worded like some masterstroke of marketting

The guy seemed a bit vague about charges for old Nintendo games. I'm guessing that probably means charges are going to exist for some titles/developers and will vary.

So yeah, essentially the usual corporate talk-up you'd get from any company. Still in the wait and see line, myself. Though the interviewee's smug attitude didn't score many points.

[Predabot]

Wow that makes Breakfast with Frost look hard hitting...

The article has absolutely nothing hard to throw at Nintendo at all, even the fact they will be the last console to launch is worded like some masterstroke of marketting

The guy seemed a bit vague about charges for old Nintendo games. I'm guessing that probably means charges are going to exist for some titles/developers and will vary.

Still in the wait and see line, myself. Though the interviewee's smug attitude didn't score many points.

How is the interviewer smug? And if he's being to lenient and soft at the ninty guy, how is him being smug at him negative?? As ussually I'm quite confused. And I still don't understand what Impy meant either..

[Kaylee]

I said interviewee.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

I agree with Karl.

The guy from Ninty trys to sound like they have this wonder product when in reality its just sales crap.
Honestly if they had a revoloution to show us, they would have at E3.

Im unconvinced about Ninty.

[Kaylee]

Honestly if they had a revoloution to show us, they would have at E3.

An excellent point!

[/backslapping contest ]

[Jetfire]

I agree with Karl.

The guy from Ninty trys to sound like they have this wonder product when in reality its just sales crap.

Isn't that his job?

the idea behind it has a appeal and a demograph that isn't exactly cornered by Song and Microsoft yet. Isn't that enough.

[Hound]

In theory Nintendo showed as much as Microsoft and Sony seeing as the latter two had demos that were running from high end macs or pc's that had 'compairable power'.

in other news - from gamesradar

[06/06/05 11:21]
A staggering 221 first-party Nintendo classics ready for download

Nintendo has finished collating and formatting all 221 of its first-party NES, SNES and N64 titles, which will be offered to Revolution users via free download when new the hardware launches in 2006.

According to an article in the latest issue of Japanese games magazine Famitsu, Nintendo will definitely offer every first-party title it's ever published for its three pre-Cube consoles for free download from day one.

Famitsu also reconfirmed that Nintendo will allow third-parties to make any number of their games available, though points out that the pricing of such titles is at the discretion of the publisher in question and as such won't necessarily be free.

While it's clear Nintendo's motive for offering its back-catalogue to customers for free is to shift its new console, third-party publishers have no self-serving motive for giving their games to Nintendo for free, so are expected to use their titles to add purchasing incentive to their own Revolution game releases.

Famitsu has also published new results for its ongoing reader survey, where readers vote for which next-gen console they're most interested in.

Revolution is once again on top, slightly extending its lead with 43% of the vote, while PS3 has suffered a big drop on previous results to 35%, and Xbox 360 has climbed to 22%.

Whether or not these figures will translate to actual real-world market share remains to be seen...

[Kaylee]

I agree with Karl.

The guy from Ninty trys to sound like they have this wonder product when in reality its just sales crap.

Isn't that his job?

the idea behind it has a appeal and a demograph that isn't exactly cornered by Song and Microsoft yet. Isn't that enough.

Job or not its still sales gubbins and the interview was hideously unobjective.

AFAIK Nintendo said nothing about their consoles specifications and didn't have even demos ready. So I don't see how they showed as much as the other major companies.

Good to hear they're releasing lots of games for free. About time someone stopped charging huge fees for video games.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

hold on ive just downloaded and watched the entire sony press sonference in highress (1.2GB files) and 1,30 mins long.

they start be showing us cell, a real working cpu, and explaining how it was made.
nintendo doesnt have any details of its cpu so

1-0 sony

then the guy from Nvidia comes along, explains how the new GPU had to fullfill certain criterior, shows it actually working and wows everyone
Ninty doesnt have a gpu spec (well they do they said it would be no where near as good...not much to shout about)

2-0 sony

then Ken K san comes on stage and explains how PS3 connects and just how power full both cpu+gpu give it silly performance via a number of demos and stuff and hails it as cool
Ninty have no idea of the how thier machine will function

3-0 Sony

then lots of different develeperos come along to show games, true some are demos, but some are real time,
ninty says its gonna be bakwards compatable, well its not much to shout about.

Id like to point out current rumours on the net are Sony and MS both thought nintys idea about downloading old games was cool and want to do it aswell - cant be hard really.

4-0sony

finnaly we are shown a realy PS3 and a controller
Ninty shows a prototype, and no controller
so ill give ninty a half a point.

5-1/2 Sony

Sony showed more then ninty on ever level. if you dont belive me watch the press conferences.
pretty clear.
and XBOX 360 was pretty clear too.

also its worth noting, big games like gears of war and perfect dark 2 were actually shown to VIP in playable form behind closed doors, which is far more then Nintys scant details could offer.

still i guess they made up for it with Zelda... sort of...

[Shanti418]

Nintendo not telling much is simply a function of their machine being released the last.

Why would you expect them to give out all the specs of their machine so far ahead of the launch? Was Microsoft giving 360 specs in Summer 2004?

Sony's spilling of the beans is simply a function of trying (pretty successfully, judging by your reaction) to rain on Microsoft's parade. I guarantee if 360 were launching at the same time as the PS3, both companies would have said a lot less.

And there should be absolutely no points awarded to Sony for anything involving PS3 controllers.

[Kaylee]

Nintendo not telling much is simply a function of their machine being released the last.

Why would you expect them to give out all the specs of their machine so far ahead of the launch? Was Microsoft giving 360 specs in Summer 2004?

Sony's spilling of the beans is simply a function of trying (pretty successfully, judging by your reaction) to rain on Microsoft's parade. I guarantee if 360 were launching at the same time as the PS3, both companies would have said a lot less.

And there should be absolutely no points awarded to Sony for anything involving PS3 controllers.

tbh I think its more a function of Nintendo not knowing specifically what their machine will actually do. They know in general terms but as they've confirmed nothing they've organised nothing.

and I'd be surprised if Sonys controllers weren't a lot better to use than they look. They surely are not stupid enough not to use ergnonomics and HCI experts in designing such things- unless they are doing the MS trick of making them purposely bad to drive people to buy a better version on top.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

I hear by all reports the X360 controllers are really very very good...
Yes Sonys do look silly...

back last year at E3 reports of the X360 system architecture was flooding onto the market and Sonys Cell had been talked of.
More importantly, Nintendo claimmed it was going to be first to the races this time round, saying it didnt want to lose the head start.

now whats more likely here is that MS and Sony have chucked in far more cash then Ninty can cope with right now, so any machine built on a level ground will be so underpowered it will look daft next to these new machines.

wait a few years and you can catch up in those terms. + a novelty and you sell some units.

still very unconvinced.


"this square box of no design is going to be a revoloution, do not look at those other two machines!!! - this will be better.... because we say so!"

[Predabot]

Sony showed more then ninty on ever level. if you dont belive me watch the press conferences.
pretty clear.
and XBOX 360 was pretty clear too.

Maybe you could download the press-release video for that one too, and make a comparison between MicroDaft and Sony? It would be quite interesting to see really. And could you please post it in here, so as I don't have to stick my rear head in the PS3 thread. Thank you.

[Kaylee]

Yeah while you're at it mark, just post Pred's response as well.

I'm sure he'd appreciate it if you made him some food too while you were there.

[Best First]

possibly load the shot gun for him and position the barrell in his mouth as well?

Does GE count as 3rd or 1st party seeing as how Ninty owned a share at the time?

[Impactor returns 2.0]

Preds? - hmm no.

GE share, good point, when Ninty sold its last shares of Rare a few years back I guess it must have been stipulated in that contract. - I presume they still have some right to it as they stuck it on thier download game list.

Have you seen GE lately? its pretty ropey next to HalfLife 2 or somthing.

but by the time you can play it again on Rev ill be playing Gears of War... hmm

[Tired Tracks]

I'll be honest and mention I haven't read all of the thread first of all. I get kind of tired of people arguing about the specs and so on.

I've found, that since last summer I have had very little interest in what has been being released in terms of games. I usually look forward to at least one or two new games every month or so, but since last year I have maybe bought 3 games in these 12 months.
Maybe its lack of interest in gaming in general, or maybe its because I'm simply tired of all the junk thats being released. The *Only* game I'm looking forward to is the new Zelda GCN game.

I'll mention now that I am against the X-box purely under the aspect that I don't care for Microsoft, I have nothing against the system or games.
When I bought my PS2, I didn't think "Oh it has all this new technology and a dvd player, and it can churn out crazy graphics" I thought "It has Final Fantasy X and Kingdom Hearts on it, and at least 3 other titles I am looking forward to playing. Same thing with the Gamecube, I didn't care that it was a step above the N64, I just wanted the new smash bros, and other nintendo games.

The current generation games look fantastic, I won't argue that. How much better could it get with the new platforms? I beleive someone mentioned in one of these threads, the addition of texture to football players bodies including pores. Who needs it? People spend so much time working on making those little extra things, that the game gets to be really short.

If I recall correctly, Super Mario Kart (SNES) had more race tracks than Mario Kart 64, and that version had about the same number of tracks as Mario Kart Double Dash(GCN), but the GCN version tracks just felt uninspired. They have better graphics, but less challenge or length, in my opinion.

One last example- PS2 Megaman X games. X7 sported a new 3-D gameplay mechanic for about 50% of the levels, included an opening cinematic, and really gave the characters a graphical overhaul. On the other hand, the high graphics somehow made the programmers produce smaller environments. To combat this, the character speed was reduced to a fraction of the past game speeds, making it feel frustrating and unwieldy.
X8 used different graphics, and threw out the 3-D gameplay. It sped up, got longer and I really enjoyed it.

Anyway, if you read this far into the post, thanks for reading it all! My main point would be that the graphics shouldn't have a negative effect on the gameplay, or take too much time away from the game, just to look nice. I'm not sure the people working on these games actually see that anymore. Until they do, I don't care how much processer power a system can use. If the revoultion has games I want, I will buy them.

[Kaylee]

Er so we're back to the 'graphics no games yes' argument...

Problem with which I has is there are only so many ways to throw pixels around a screen before you need something new under the hood to make something different.

New tech = new games = more scope for greatness.

Lest anyone forget that the 'great' games were all top of the line when they came out as well. Nobody decided to make Tetris for a retro feel it was as good as could be done at the time. Same for just about every game worth playing.

So "Oh it has all this new technology and a dvd player, and it can churn out crazy graphics" I thought "It has Final Fantasy X and Kingdom Hearts on it, and at least 3 other titles I am looking forward to playing" I see your point but without said technology none of those games would have been possible. Hence the discussion of it and what these new technologies might bring and speculation about other strategies to bring something new to the living room, like Nintendo essentially cashing in its chips by retooling its old games (which you can only do once... what will they do when people have bought them and got all their games? Since the games are free and don't require a monthly subscriptions AFAIK.)

[Impactor returns 2.0]

graphics get better, enviroments get more detailed, games are more fun.

You should go look at what the next gen systems offer first.

I can list many a scenario where the power of these systems makes for better gameplay.

Power need not = graphics, but complex physics, and again, this need not = reality but underlying complexity.

[Best First]

possibilities are only relevant when developers are creative enough to take advantage of them though.

In some cases the transition to 3d did wonders - e.g GTA or Mario but in other sit was massively for the sake of it.

Just as much the opportunities offerred by the newer breed of consoles will be taken up by some, but ignored by many who will continue to churn out turgid mediocre fare.

As i see it the sceanrio will remain that there will be a number of 'must have' games scattered across all 3 systems, but the market will continue to exhibit far less creativity than it did a decade ago, as the price of failure is so much greater.

to conclude: meh.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

thats true, hence sequals.

but like great films, if I get 3 per year must have games im generally happy.

CUrrently what ive seen of these new systems, some things on offer are just crazy, were not talking 3D texture maps any more, its all shaders etc... this ig going to be like playing in a real enviroment where you truly can interact with almost everything. the possibilitys are endless...

[Best First]

thats true, hence sequals.

but like great films, if I get 3 per year must have games im generally happy.

CUrrently what ive seen of these new systems, some things on offer are just crazy, were not talking 3D texture maps any more, its all shaders etc... this ig going to be like playing in a real enviroment where you truly can interact with almost everything. the possibilitys are endless...

i agree - i just don't expect to see many of those possibilities explored in most cases.

Then again i agree 3 games a year is more than enough for me these days - i have only just staretd playing Star Wars KOTOR... (its ace so far).

[Shanti418]

For me, the graphical power of the PS3 is the only reason I will possibly buy it.

If the PS3 and 360 were virtually the same machine, I would buy a 360, because just like how TT's got it out for MS, I've got it out for Sony.

I've gone through three PS2s while having one Xbox and one GC. Damn Sony for turning game consoles into just another appliance with planned obsolescence. They suck, they suck, they suck.

But they have the games (thus far, although MS bit into the massive lead they had from the PS era), and so you have to play them.

All I'm saying is this: I like MS, I like Xbox Live, I like old Ninty games. I don't like the new PS3 controllers. I don't need a multimedia port whore that costs $400+ that will plug into lots of devices I don't have.

And I guarantee you, I'm not the only one.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

Both machines are multi format port whores, well via blue tooth and wireless etc..

As for games, the PS3 really does look next gen where as 360 (whilst nice dont get me wrong) looks like super high end PC.

the PS3 in time will show how vastly more powerfull it is.

I think ill return to the point anyway.

Why does ninty continue to try and make a games console that is going to be underpowered compared to these two huge giants?

why not just focus on doing what it does best - making games?
ie - sega

[Shanti418]

Both machines are multi format port whores, well via blue tooth and wireless etc..

As for games, the PS3 really does look next gen where as 360 (whilst nice dont get me wrong) looks like super high end PC.

the PS3 in time will show how vastly more powerfull it is.

As far as ports, I was referring to the PS3 having Ethernet (RJ45), 6 USB 2.0, CF Slot (Type I, II), SD Slot (Regular, Compact), Memory Stick, Memory Stick Duo, 1 x Optical Audio, while 360 has only 3 USB 2.0, 2 Memory Slots, Ethernet Port (RJ45)

And as I said, PS3's graphical "oh, looks at us, we'res sos good lookings!!!" is the only reason I would consider buying it.

Now....

Why does ninty continue to try and make a games console that is going to be underpowered compared to these two huge giants?

why not just focus on doing what it does best - making games?
ie - sega

Well, if you've paid attention to anything Nintendo has said pre, during, or post E3, they have stated repeatedly that they feel that power, processing, and graphics are not enough to win the console war. They feel that power is irrelevant compared to a unique experince and fun gameplay.

While that argument may or may not be wrong, it's certainly a respectable position. And recent history shows that the two consoles with the best hardware (N64 and Xbox) do not always win the war.

[Impactor returns 2.0]

Power = better games.

Ninty doesnt have it.

what they said at E3 is what anyone else would say in thier postion.

I really dont think ppl understand how good these new systems really are, they will offer new gamming experiences on many levels. and if ninty hasnt got the power to explore these new avenues then its left in the past.

They should bite the bullet and make games for MS and Sony.

As for hating a manufactuere, if these two huge companies didnt get involved hardware development would be 5 years behind. - you would spend more.

[Shanti418]

But even if Ninty has been lost in the past, you're STILL assuming that the past is not and can not be a profitable venture. :P